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Merkel slammed for joy over bin Laden killing

The Local · 4 May 2011, 18:23

Published: 04 May 2011 09:06 GMT+02:00
Updated: 04 May 2011 18:23 GMT+02:00

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Katrin Göring-Eckardt, Green party MP, Bundestag vice president and leading member of the Evangelical Church of Germany, told the Berliner Zeitung she was glad bin Laden was no longer leading a terrorist group. “But you can’t be happy about his death,” she said.

On Monday, Merkel told reporters that bin Laden’s death at the hands of US forces was “good news.”

“I’m glad that killing bin Laden was successful,” she said.

The criticism of Merkel's comments came not only from political opposition, but from her own party, echoing discomfort expressed by some observers at the emotional, celebratory reaction of many Americans and foreign politicians around the world after bin Laden’s killing.

Siegfried Kauder, a member of Merkel’s conservative Christian Democratic Union (CDU), slammed her remarks, calling them reminiscent of something a person would say in the “middle ages.”

“I would not have formulated them like this,” he said to the Passauer Neuen Presse, expressing doubts that killing bin Laden was even legal under international law.

Other politicians said they would have preferred to see bin Laden arrested.

Martin Lohmann, in charge of the CDU’s Working Group of Engaged Catholics, said killing anyone, even a terrorist, “can never be cause for joy for a Christian.”

“It would have been better if Osama bin Laden had been arrested and brought to justice,” he added.

Merkel's spokesman Steffen Seibert was forced later on Wednesday to defend her comments.

"This sentence should not be treated in isolation," Seibert told a regular briefing. "The motivation for her being pleased was that this man no longer poses a danger. The world will hopefully be a bit safer now."

He added that Merkel "appreciates that someone hearing just this one sentence - and on television it was often only this sentence that was broadcast - maybe found 'death' and being 'pleased' in the same sentence as inappropriate."

Despite the criticism, most German political figures said they were relieved bin Laden would no longer be stirring up trouble.

Meanwhile, German’s BND intelligence chief Ernst Uhrlau said bin Laden’s death didn’t necessarily mean an improvement in the nation's security.

Story continues below…

“The security forces must remain very vigilant,” he told the Hamburger Abendblatt newspaper, though he described the US operation as a success.

Uhrlau emphasized that bin Laden no longer had a day-to-day role in planning terrorist operations, but he acknowledged the man’s power as a “role model” and said terrorists would not easily be able to fill the gap bin Laden’s death leaves.

DAPD/The Local/AFP/mdm

The Local (news@thelocal.de)

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Your comments about this article

09:52 May 4, 2011 by lwexcel
¦quot;It would have been better if Osama bin Laden had been arrested and brought to justice,¦quot;

And by justice you mean what exactly? ...He was going to be killed one way or another. As for the legalities of the situation, I highly doubt we will be seeing the executive branch or the DoD in court anytime soon.
10:22 May 4, 2011 by B-Squared
They've got to find something to complain about....Typisch
11:04 May 4, 2011 by FredFinger
The germans. Almost unbelievable.

Anyway, Obama was simply following the lead of Winston Chuchhill who wanted Hitler executed immediately if captured after World War II. You don't give a charismatic enemy the opportunity to garner any points during the necessarily long and protracted trial.
11:06 May 4, 2011 by Ami-in-Germany
IDIOTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Signed proud American living in Germany.
11:28 May 4, 2011 by StoutViking
Bin Laden? Charismatic? Give me a break...

I won't shed a tear for a despicable character such as Bin-Laden, but if they could have captured him alive they shoulda done it, even if only to let the masses gaze at the monster. Kind of makes me look back at the Neurenberg Trials. Sure, they took too long, they had a few "woopsies" but they were right.

Western nations speak of democracy and fair trial, for everyone, then they execute him without one. Sure, he's guilty, but I think a trial must be held.

You see, fellas, Hypocricy is the best recruitment tool for terrorists. And if the West can't stand up to its standards, who will?

I must admit I can't keep face to the people who condone the one's joy over the hit. I bet these are the same people who keep silent when it comes to condemning terror acts, ain't it?
12:01 May 4, 2011 by catjones
Critic's solution:

1. Get signed (a Pakistani judge will do) arrest warrant.

2. Pakistani police knock on bin Laden door.

3. "Come with us. You're under arrest".

4. Osama being Osama, complies.

5. Have trial.

6. Await verdict.
12:37 May 4, 2011 by ChrisRea
If a neighbour kills my family and he also publicly admit and brag about it, of course I am going after him and kill him on the spot. I do not need to observe the law, especially as I have the best guns in my neighbourhood. This is how Obama reacted. And is is not the first time or the last time that USA had this approach. Practical, based on force rather than law or moral standards, easy to be considered defiant. It is not by chance that the death penalty and carrying a gun are generally accepted things in the USA. Just as in the Wild West you would not wait for the sheriff/judge, but kill the Indian that did something to your family. And then get away with this, as all your fellows would agree with you. They would even celebrate with you.

Europe/Germany has a more law-oriented approach. Justice is more trusted, even if it takes longer. But things should be done by the book, through established institutions. It is much better to let a criminal escape than to punish an innocent (hence the death penalty was abolished, so that judicial errors would not kill an innocent). And redemption is more important than revenge, so the killing of another human cannot be a reason for joy.

So of course Angela Merkel's American reaction was not welcomed by Germans, even if they agree that Osama bin Laden was a threat. It is also stranger due to her father's pastoral formation. But Angela Merkel already broke many traditions (leads a West German Catholic party even if she is a Lutheran Ossie, divorced her first husband and lived with her current husband even before they were married).
12:51 May 4, 2011 by Angry Ami
Comment removed by The Local for breach of our terms.
13:20 May 4, 2011 by melbournite
Thank-you for a small voice of sanity. There is a very good reason why presumption of innocence and the rule of Law are essential to a civilized society. It takes a special type of barbarism to crow over an extra-judicial murder and then claim that God gave you the strength to do it. "Thou shalt not kill", hypocrites
13:23 May 4, 2011 by Sastry.M
Brawn is the virtue of beasts in the wilds but law and justice is the virtue of human beings living in civilized democratic societies. This is possible only when standards are singularly upheld and maintained for the welfare of self and society alike. If, however, self is only chosen as the priority of interest as a divine willed prerogative standards are forced into double and might of self becomes the right of justice for others. This is the motto of dictatorships and is applicable to both democracy as well autocracy depending on how standards are maintained.

The sufferings of German people during the last century and the blame they bear to date has probably instilled a sense of caution do enjoy all success with a vigilant single standard than fall for frenzied double.
14:15 May 4, 2011 by ovalle3.14
It's the US we're speaking about. Did anyone really expect a different outcome here? Not to mention US military personnel cannot be tried under the International Court of Justice. My playground, my rules.
14:42 May 4, 2011 by jbaker
Joy over killng a person? Go kill someone with your own hands and see how much joy this brings you. Most people could not kill the animals they eat everyday.
14:50 May 4, 2011 by Katzerina
"It is not by chance that the death penalty and carrying a gun are generally accepted things in the USA. "

Mind boggling... I think you watch too many Hollywood movies ChrisRea?

There actually exists this little thing called "The Constitution," which in the most simple language describes how America is a nation based on laws.

Take for example your use of the abbreviation " USA", aka United STATES of America, this means laws can vary greatly from State to State. Perhaps you were unaware that depending on WHICH state you reside, there may or may NOT be a death penalty. There are also a myriad of laws on the books, depending again on WHICH state you live in, as to whether or not you may "carry" a weapon, openly or concealed.

The second amendment to the constitution does declare the right of the individual to own the means for self protection, there is an active debate on how far state laws can infringe on that right. Each State has it's own laws pertaining to "Castle laws" .... at what point do you have the right to defend personal property, as in your house from an intruder breaking in. Seriously, law abiding citizens are not running around shooting people.

Now there have been many studies done, that in states that issue "right to carry" laws, gun violence happens to be very low. Why is that you think? Well for one thing, MOST people fall into the category of "law abiding" citizens. Laws, you see.... generally effect only the law abiding. Criminals are criminals, based on their criminal behavior... which means they don't necessarily decide to live according to our civil laws.

In your world, everyone is a criminal, therefore create the most stringent laws possible... so that only the criminals are armed. Is that the hallmark of a civil society? Consider what the world looks like to a criminal, if they know that there is a possibility that you the lone citizen, may actually have the means to defend themselves? Not so inviting perhaps...

In terms of the death of OBL.... I haven't seen excessive jubilation, nor have I seen crowds of unruly people celebrating by burning cars, or smashing storefronts. Never mind, I now remember where and when THAT happens...
16:07 May 4, 2011 by Beachrider
Hmmm. Some are using this event for a forum to further-hate the USA. So be it for them, I don't think that I have the time or inclination to change their hardened minds.

OBL was clearly hunted under generally-accepted rules of battle for 9+ years. Since President Obama's start, we have gone beyond those rules, because we felt that someone was assisting him and lying to us about it. He was found about a hour north of Islamabad, the capital of Pakistan, hundreds of miles inside the Pakistan border. There is evidence that this compound was used as his residence for years.

Pakistan wasn't going to permit extradition. You can argue about why, but NO ONE believes that we could have presented an extradition warrant and walk away with a prisoner.

Putting a close to OBL's activities is the best way to put him behind us. If you feel that his individual rights were more important than the hundred-thousand-plus people affected by his plans and practices, then you are in that group that will gain NOTHING from ANY discussion about his crimes.

I hope that the USA can now heal its wounds on this issue. I DO want the soldiers to come home from Afghanistan (and Iraq, for god's sake).

Perhaps some of you can understand.
16:14 May 4, 2011 by free range cheese

An armed society is a polite society. That is why Europeans tend to be so impolite and obnoxious.
16:17 May 4, 2011 by Mr Goodmorning
I would have rather seen bin Laden have to face the families of the victims and the hundreds of blinded Africans as well famlies of the 11 Muslims he murdered in the African embassy bombings, the victims of Madrid, USS Cole, London subway bomings, the Bali Bomings and of course the 9/11 attacks in criminal proceedings. That being said, this action was perfectly legal, being a military action executed under long standing internationally established military rules of engagement.
16:22 May 4, 2011 by FredFinger
@ free range cheese

Yeah, thats why american society is polite, one perceived slight and you're history. The peace is maintained by those quickest on the draw. Yikes!
16:42 May 4, 2011 by cindinator
Would these be the same people that would have said it sent the wrong message when it was discovered Hitler was dead? Sounds like maybe they have some mus lim terrorists supporters within their government, not unlike the US.
16:44 May 4, 2011 by loriboxer
The truth is ... who gives a crap what the rest of the world thinks. Justice is done, and, hopefully, the reports of his body being washed, wrapped and ceremoniously buried at sea is also bunk. Instead, I hope the reality is that they simply threw him overboard.
17:09 May 4, 2011 by ChrisRea
@ Beachrider & Mr Goodmorning

For what I know, rules of battle apply only within a war. Please don't say that the so-called "War on Terror" is a real war. Even the Obama administration calls it "Overseas Contingency Operation". In the US, only the Congress has the right to declare war and there was nothing like this regarding OBL/al-Qaeda. Or do you have other information?

The big question raised was why didn't they take Obama prisoner so that he could face justice. He was unarmed and there was no threat or urgency to kill him. The two possible explanations I found were that either US was not confident that they could retain him (which sounds improbable) or that they were afraid what he could say in a public trial (about his early experiences with the US, about his connections with high-ranking Americans etc). Taking him prisoner would not have meant to work against the interest of, I quote, " the hundred-thousand-plus people affected by his plans and practices". On the contrary, it would mean showing respect to them, even if some would not understand this.
17:13 May 4, 2011 by melbournite
@cindinator small difference.. Hitler killed himself to prevent the Russians putting him on trial. That puts the US to the Right of Stalin
17:14 May 4, 2011 by bugger
Amazing how naive and clueless the Europeans are. As they pass judgement on USA, EU is already executing on plans for European South Mediterranean Alliance - Dar Al Islam. This alliance will make Middle East countries like Egypt, Libya, Tunisia, Jordan, Palestine and 8 other part of EU - or Eurabia. Kind of like the Schengen treaty.

I can't imagine what the Moslem Brotherhood thugs will do in the streets of Europe given what they did to US reporters Lara Logan. Europeans seem to have a penchant for self destruction and self hate. They will be assimilated, it is just a matter of time unless they wake up now.
17:20 May 4, 2011 by sonnyboy1
Probably these people wouldn't have wanted Hitler killed either
17:22 May 4, 2011 by AlgiersPoint
God bless Angela Merkel for having an honest reaction to the good news that the major terrorist of our time had died. She was honest and staight forward, evidently that doesn't play well with the politically correct and the morally superior. As an American I am very proud of our armed forces and I thank God they finally got Osama bin Laden. We can check him off the list and go on to the next one. Killing is not something we like to do, but we are good at it and we don't give up. We will get the job done.
17:27 May 4, 2011 by stevenseagal
Comment removed by The Local for breach of our terms.
17:33 May 4, 2011 by ChrisRea
@ Katzerina

I probably touched a sensible spot and that was not my intention. I simply gave my explanations/comments for "Merkel slammed for joy over bin Laden killing". To use your wording, the article talks about people considering that Angela Merkel was excessively jubilating.

Because I do not want to leave you with a boggled mind, I will shortly explain what "... the death penalty and carrying a gun are generally accepted things in the USA " means.

"Gallup's annual Crime Survey finds that 64% of Americans continue to support the use of the death penalty for persons convicted of murder, while 29% oppose it -- continuing a trend that has shown little change over the last seven years." November 8, 2010, http://www.gallup.com/poll/144284/Support-Death-Penalty-Cases-Murder.aspx

"Nearly two-thirds of Americans say they believe the Constitution guarantees each person the right to own a gun, according to a poll released Sunday (December 16, 2007). In all, 65 percent said they thought the Constitution ensures that right, and 31 percent said it did not. The question had a sampling error of plus-or-minus 3 points." http://articles.cnn.com/2007-12-16/us/guns.poll_1_constitution-sampling-error-opinion-research-corporation?_s=PM:US

Unfortunately, the above information does not come from American movies, but from the crude reality. I actually do not watch many American movies. Should I? I currently prefer the European and the Japanese ones.

I will not answer your groundless assertions on my opinion regarding carrying a gun, as I did not make any personal statement in this regard.
17:35 May 4, 2011 by stevenseagal
Comment removed by The Local for breach of our terms.
17:37 May 4, 2011 by tcall
I speaking of Germany, "...a more law oriented approach. Justice is more trusted..."?? Tell that to the millions of Jews killed at the hands of Germans. It took the USA's sense of justice to stop Germans from killing more and was paid for with the lives of millions of American soldiers. Germany has more blood on its hands than any other nation on earth. We don't need to be taking your lead in terms of "justice". The USA would have been putting American soldiers at risk by attempting to capture him alive. For what purpose? To execute him in the end? He has been responsible for too many deaths and has caused too much instability as it is.
17:37 May 4, 2011 by ChrisRea
A relevant quote for the article, incorrectly attributed to Martin Luther King Jr.:

"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that."
17:39 May 4, 2011 by TRJ
I am dismayed to read so many denunciations of the methods employed by America in killing OBL. This was a man who engineered mass killings, boasted of it afterward and swore to continue his work until "a bullet takes me." Yet somehow, according to many commenters here, the soldiers involved are expected to assume that he would behave like a kitten when finally confronted. Asking soldiers engaged in a firefight to assume that their target - a man who financed countless suicide bombings and openly encouraged their use and his own intentions toward martyrdom- would abandon all of these principles at the final moment of his life. He was killed to assure he didn't kill in the moment.

But Germans pointing the finger at barbarism by others is now commonplace as one of the 12 steps to recovery for the transgressions of their history. Germans should thank America in this instance for finally giving you a podium from which you can judge instead of your near-permanent status as the judged.
18:03 May 4, 2011 by free range cheese

They bathed his carcas with melted lard then chucked him out of the back of a C-130 somewhere over the Indian Ocean. The hagfish are having a feast.
18:11 May 4, 2011 by finanzdoktor
Just food for thought:

1. Chancellor Merkel said she was glad, not joyous, a difference.

2. The Germans living today were not involved in the Holocaust.

3. As American, I too am happy that a sworn enemy (OBL's words, not mine) is dead.

4. Did Germany react to the same celebrations that took place in the Middle East when the events of 9-11 occurred? If so, then your condemnation of our "happiness" is noted. If not, then couldn't that be interpreted as hypocritical?

5. The threat of OBL was/is not focused on the U.S. alone. He and his cronies were/are a threat to all freedoms.

Haven't said that much since 9-11. Thank you.
18:11 May 4, 2011 by Chicago1996
Everyone stop with the German bashing. There are plenty of right wing and left wing nuts in the US that are coming out of the woodwork right now and are condemning the actions taken by the Obama administration. It is all political grandstanding ­ nothing more and nothing less and should not be a reflection of society as a whole.

Personally, as a German living in the US since 1996, I can honestly say that the SOB deserved what was coming to him. I do not fault anyone for openly celebrating OBL¦#39;s demise when they found out what had happened. His terrorist acts over the decades have changed the rules of engagement and life as I view and live it forever.

I think of him every time I have to walk through an airport body scanner, fill my Ziploc bag with benign liquid toiletries, and see parents and their newborn infants have their baby formula confiscated by the TSA.

I think of OBL every time I meet with one of my consultant¦#39;s whose brother was sitting at his desk in the Pentagon on 9/11. He managed to survive the attack, but spent the next 6+ months in the ICU for receiving burns over 50% of his body. He had a wife and two little kids at the time. That family¦#39;s life has changed forever.

I thought about OBL when I signed up for an E-trade account a few years back and had the audacity to transfer a measly $1,000 into it. No sooner that I did this, E-trade froze my assets and the account. What was my crime? As a foreigner opening up a trading account with petty cash, I had fallen under the Patriot Act. That¦#39;s it. It took me two months to sort out the bureaucratic mess and get my money back.

As far as I am concerned, OBL drew a bulls¦#39; eye on his forehead the moment the first plane crashed into one of the Twin Towers. I¦#39;m glad they gunned him down and I make no apologies for it.
18:11 May 4, 2011 by ANONTDH

Mr. Trump Card is insulting the office of the President of the United States. So are the others who are using him as an attack dog. SHAME ON YOU, SHAME ON ALL.

If you really want to destroy these beautiful United States of America, please do vote for

Mr. TRUMP CARD. It surely will expedite the process. Before you do that, please check

the following RUMORS about the TRUMP CARD:

1. He was not born in the United States either (Birth Certificate?)

2. He is a Jew but claims to be a Christian (Bar Mitzvah or Baptization?)

3. He is promoting Gambling (Casinos), womanizing (adultery) and admitted

SCREWING Qaddafi on TV (committing acts of cheating and fraud)

4. Ask him where did he get all the money from? PROOF OF THE PRODUCT?

5. He could not manage three wives, admitted his failure and divorced them.

6. One of his daughter is having or had a child out of wedlock (Family values?)

7. And many more to come.

Please ask him to rebut these so called rumors by providing documentary evidences from the local, the state and/or the federal authorities before OFFICIALLY announcing his candidacy for the highest elected office in the United States of America.

A man, who cannot manage his own personal affairs, has repeatedly failed in business VENTURES, divorced his wives and has no moral values to speak of, how can he manage the affairs of more that 300 million people of the United States of America? THINK and Think again!

He's an inexperienced dude with NO real plan for the country, (he's like a snake oil charmer, selling hope in a bottle to the masses). He will tell you that he can get rid of trillions of dollars of debt in the first year of his presidency. Yes he can.

That¦#39;s what he has done all his life. He will put the United States on the BLOCK and sell it to highest bidder, including China, get rid of the debt and everything will be fine and dandy. Your children and grandchildren will not have to pay anything to anyone,

any more.

United States of America, the greatest nation on this earth will be FREE at last

from all those hypocrites, who are bickering about the debt and balancing the budget.

FREE at last, free at last, once for all. FREE AT LAST.

May God bless America and save us all from the evil intentions of Mr. TRUMP CARD, Amen.
18:15 May 4, 2011 by Pavelina
I'm grateful he was not captured alive and given one of our very expensive trials where he's presumed innocent until proven guilty. Think of the anguish and bitterness that would probably have caused the families of all those he was responsible for killing.

The decision to kill Osama was best for us, and will not make any real difference in the plans Islam has for us infidels.
18:16 May 4, 2011 by eldiabs
Europe has been responsible for over seventy million MURDERS in the 20th Century alone. Let's not forget the abject raping of ALL of Africa. Remember the "Belgian" Congo, "Dutch" South Africa and of course the silly Brits and French follies there as well. Also let's not forget the French and British occupation of Iran, Iraq, Egypt, Tunisia, Libya, Morocco and last but not least PALESTINE. Boy you guys sure are scum. How many innocent people over the last thousand years were killed to save the vanity of some king or queen? The US obviously has a lot to learn from Europe about murder and rape. One last suggestion; remember Mecca is eastward. Enjoy secular rule while you still have it.
18:16 May 4, 2011 by Katzerina
Chris.... You do realize that the American system of governance is based on a democratic republic model, or a representative democracy. Polls are just that... a sample of an overall population, if that were reflective of the US laws and system, one would consider that akin to living under mob rule!

Americans do not vote on laws directly, they vote for representatives that hopefully represent their best interests. Of course there are local laws that make it to a ballot from time to time, but not on the federal level. I'm not sure that Europeans understand the system of the electoral college, and that Americans don't even vote for the President directly.

In terms of legal matters, Americans rely on the verdict of the supreme court to uphold or dismiss laws that are not in keeping with the constitution. As supreme court nominees are appointed by one political party or another, of course there will be a certain amount of innate bias. That's why elections are held. And btw... the supremes did uphold the second amendment as an individuals right to bear arms.

Politicians like polls, to bolster what they're doing... but unless there is enough support to add or remove an amendment to the constitution, a poll only reflects a momentary opinion.
18:17 May 4, 2011 by vonkoenigsberg
The GREEN Party...typical idiots. I wouldn't get too worked up over what they say. Merkel is a good Chancellor and said the absolute right thing. Why is expressing joy over evil's deminse a bad thing?
18:21 May 4, 2011 by Wolf girl
Any German who doesn't rejoice over Osama bin Laden being killed is a crackpot. So many Germans don't know their ass from a hole in the ground when it comes to a sense of right and wrong.
18:27 May 4, 2011 by Renagle
@Katzerina; Brilliant answer that will not penetrate the anti-American bigots most obviously in this thread. You're denying these mental midgets their ignorant perceptions of an enormous country with 50 different sets of laws have probably never even stepped foot inside. Angela Merkel had the right reaction. The next celebration will come when Castro dies and the millions of Cubans in the US dance with joy. My friends in Miami are already planning for their party...who cares what these Euro fools think. As if NON celebrating would actually make them ponder, "Hey, those Americans ain't so bad after all! What class they have! I've been wrong in my opinion of them all along!" Yeah, that's a laugh. Once a hater, always a hater. @Chicago 1996: I agree you're absolutely right. Glad to see your not like the rest of the fools here.
18:29 May 4, 2011 by navin jay
Mach es dir selber NAZIs!

Keep your post-modern sentiments to yourself.
18:33 May 4, 2011 by stop2think
Figures. While Europe dithers and watches their population being overrun by angry Muslims, it takes the good ol' USA to take care of business. Yes, Germany, the same USA that saved you from Hitler, spent millions in treasure protecting you from the Soviets, and who allowed you to develop into a free nation. How can such a great nation such as Germany become such pansies?
18:37 May 4, 2011 by free range cheese

Thanks for reminding me that I forgot obtuse and conceited.
18:51 May 4, 2011 by ChrisRea
Oh, I was wondering when will Nazis be brought into the discussion, even if there is no real connection (other than being the favourite subject when one has no argument).

By the way, did you know that American intelligence officials created a ¦quot;safe haven¦quot; in the United States for Nazis and their collaborators after World War II? Look what the government officials say: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/14/us/14nazis.html

Someone said: "It took the USA's sense of justice to stop Germans from killing more and was paid for with the lives of millions of American soldiers." Good joke, right? Politics in the last century, as well as now, have nothing to do with justice.
19:01 May 4, 2011 by Englishted
ANONTDH go see a doctor.

Right or wrong ,how and why, I don't care I'm just glad the sh## is dead.

Gives a new meaning to taking the bin out .
19:07 May 4, 2011 by Anton_Shrek
The Pakastanis knew Osama was living there. They had to. They could have knocked politely on Osama's door at anytime they wanted to, arrested him peacefully, gave him a fair trial and returned him to his compound to live out his days under house arrest. But no, they wanted the $1.5B in aid the US had been giving them, so Osama had to remain hidden. Wasn't Osama's plan to bleed the US dry? Surprise, surprise, the Americans finally got wise and showed up with a Kill Team and now the world gets to be offended. Good for you.
19:09 May 4, 2011 by Major-General Sir Binden-Blood
Mrs Merkel should jump for joy! Best thing to happen this year so far! the animal Bin Laden put down! A good reason to celebrate!
19:11 May 4, 2011 by gophillies
The practical, common-sense reason for not taking Osama a live is that terrorists will simply begin taking hostages to demand his release, which would not happen hence more pointless death. I suspect most Germans realize this as well, but simply cannot resist criticizing the United States at any turn, no matter how petty and ridiculous their arguments are.
19:13 May 4, 2011 by HarryFenton
So, maybe instead of "Freude", her reaction should have been "Schadenfreude"? Would that make everyone feel better about Merkel's correct reaction of happiness in response to the death of a brutal mass murderer? Relax, it's not like she's handing out candies and singing in the public square at the targeted death of innocent schoolchildren by Hamas rocket fire. Even Germans don't do that anymore.
19:17 May 4, 2011 by JeromeB
If an American military person with a firearm is close enough to OBL to arrest him, the history will record that OBL resisted and forced the soldier to use a higher level of force. Why? Because the history is written by the United States.
19:24 May 4, 2011 by scottUSA
Bin Laden's fate was sealed the moment his security forces fired at American soldiers. In that situation, deep inside a friendly Pakistan, with the potential for further armed resistance, booby-traps in the home, "martyrdom" (as he has convinced so many other to do) or a pre-arranged escape route, failing a complete and immediate surrender upon arrival of the US forces his death was inevitable. Those advocating a more cautious approach under these circumstances fail to acknowledge Bin Laden's ultimate goal of using weapons of mass destruction against "the infidels" (ask yourself if that includes Germans?) and the imperative to stop that at almost any cost - certainly at the cost of his life.

As for the celebrations here in the US - everyone should note how quickly they have died down too. Ridding the world of a mass murderer is a cause for joy (initially) then reflection (the current mood of the country). This was a 10 year effort to find and bring a very dangerous man to justice - o
19:24 May 4, 2011 by Colorado34
I understand the argument that the 'West' needs a higher standard and that we should have arrested him if possible. I do understand this. I dont agree, the U.S is in a war, and war is not nice and the U.S intentions were clear, if given a chance we were going to kill him.

But what I dont understand about Europeans is their lack of action in Libya, why did you let hundreds of civilians die before moving? How about Kosovo, Rwanda etc. How can they sit by and watch the slaughter, is this because you need to take legal action first? I pray the U.S never gets this 'civilized' if a dictator like Ghaddfi or Milosvik (sp?) are in our back yard.
19:25 May 4, 2011 by DestroyZOG
Comment removed by The Local for breach of our terms.
19:34 May 4, 2011 by VonHeid
If I am correct, there were former Nazi sympathizers who where committing acts of terror after the "conclusion" of WWII. They engaged in assassinations and bombings in the hopes that they could prevent people from supporting the new way of things. If they were caught out of uniform they were given a quick military trial and executed. The road from being caught to being executed was pretty straightforward. Had Osama been caught during that period the end result would have been the same for him.

In a perfect world he would have been brought to trial, but in a perfect world he wouldn't have committed the atrocities that he did. I can see both sides of this but have lean in the direction of bringing his terrorist activities to a quick end.
19:44 May 4, 2011 by tadchem
I don't think it's "joy" as much as an overwhelming feeling of relief that something that had to be done has finally been done. Imagine how you would feel when the laxative kicks in after ten years of constipation.
19:44 May 4, 2011 by shablon
Comment removed by The Local for breach of our terms.
19:49 May 4, 2011 by karldehm
You can't please all the people all the time, but you can fool some of the people all the time.

Of course, he should have been brought to trial, but what good would that have done. I'm glad he's gone. Now, lets get on with our lives.
19:54 May 4, 2011 by coscallis
Excerpt from: The MLF Lullaby- Tom Lehrer

Once all the Germans were warlike and mean,

But that couldn't happen again.

We taught them a lesson in 1918

And they've hardly bothered us since then.
20:01 May 4, 2011 by BigLipZulu
Yikes, how weak have the German people become? They've become absolute slaves to the evil of political correctness and guilt. For a people that once use to be so strong and dynamic, now they ALLOW themselves to live in a constant state of guilt and shame for the Holocaust and even force that guilt and shame on generations that had absolutely nothing to do with it, and they bow to political correctness as if it's some god. Time for Germans to grow Kehonees again and return to being among the leaders in world affairs.
20:10 May 4, 2011 by Blaueauge

"Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that."

As a Christian it is very annoying that you, a non believer,

in order to support your view, will freely use a quote that is a paraphrase of a Biblical verse.

I will not go into the hypocrisy of it, only to say that I'm sure you have no concept of what true light is and how it overcomes darkness. Or what true love is and how it how it overcomes hate.
20:20 May 4, 2011 by Krag
They should have brought his body back to Ground Zero, wrapped it in a freshly killed pig's skin and left it to rot there!

It worked in the Philippines!
20:44 May 4, 2011 by euskept
Comment removed by The Local for breach of our terms.
20:45 May 4, 2011 by Thorsten
The political correct media/experts do not represent the German people.

However, for nearly 70 years we live in total peace and are getting weak, decadent, spoiled and lazy. Look at the "intellectuals", who feel sorry for our enemies and cry about western imperialism, islamophobia and all this nonsense. It is so ridicolous, maybe it would be good for our nation/people, if someone declared war on us!

I don't care about international law, or the human rights of our enemies. Kill as many as possible!

@shablon You conspiracy-monkeys are nuts. Do you really think that the US killed 3000 civilians in 911 and made dozens of other terror attacks, so that they could spend billions on nationalbuilding of Afghanistan? Cui bono? Nobody. The US could have attacked Afghanistan/Iraq without 911 and even the islamists don't benefit from 911. It was an act of silly, retared islamists, who all deserve to die.
20:54 May 4, 2011 by sebastian2010
everyone is always talking about WW2 Germany killing Jews. I am not proud of WW2 Germany......but America is not that much better.... Germany tried to wipe out Jews but America tried to wipe out the native indians. And used slaves for 500years . EVERY NATION HAS BLOOD ON THIER HANDS> some more than others but they all have it
21:14 May 4, 2011 by jgfox
I remember the reports of bin Laden smiling and applauding as the first Tower went down.

¦quot;Tape shows bin Laden laughing about attack¦quot;

¦quot;OSAMA BIN LADEN laughed and boasted that the collapse of the World Trade Centre exceeded his expectations, in a video released by the US government today.¦quot;


I¦#39;m happy and celebrating that we got the murderous bastard.

I only wish that we had wrapped him in a pig skin and the only funeral service he received before he was sent to feed the fishes was the reading of the names of all his 9/11 victims.

Great evil suffered a defeat and only those morally challenged don¦#39;t celebrate.

I guess Ms. Katrin Göring-Eckardt will walk out of the final Potter movie in protest when Lord Voldamort is destroyed without due process.

The Greens should be elated for the recycling effort which provided needed nutrients to Oceania.
21:22 May 4, 2011 by Hammer of Thor
JUSTICE was served swiftly and correctly. This was also the best use of tax payer Dollars ever!!!!

Germans may point, scowl, and act like two year olds if they don't get their way, but Americans have the balls to fight back.

By the way, how's Germany doing with the increasing Muslim population? yeah.. I thought so. Do you feel safe riding the U-Bahn at night in the city? No? Maybe you need an American to make your streets safer too. Whenever you need us, just call. Someone has to have balls to save Germany and we know it won't be the Germans. Pussies.

Greetings from Afghanistan.
21:29 May 4, 2011 by Freeman
This is so ridiculous. .Does this mean Lie as a politician or speak truthfully? Personally I've "no comment" here.
21:34 May 4, 2011 by melbournite
My goodness, what a cesspool of proto-fascist reaction. Law and a legal process is not for the benefit of the criminal, its for the benefit of all of us.
21:34 May 4, 2011 by TheCrownPrince
Thorsten, #63: "The political correct media/experts do not represent the German people. ... I don't care about international law, or the human rights of our enemies. Kill as many as possible! "

Sorry, but this must be the biggest nonsense I have read so far on this subject. In my opinion OBL should have been brought to trial, if at all possible. We as western civilization simply don't have the right to disregard the rule of law, how extraordinary the single case may be. If there really was an order to eliminate OBL in the first place, you might call it "unlawful killing" with some justification. Nobody here grieves over the loss OBL, but it is all about the basic principles our societies are founded upon. Even the death penalty after a trial I would have understood, as the Israelis did with Eichmann, who murdered millions from behind his desk, and not "just" 3.000 (with all respect).

As for Merkel: I guess she only was clumsy with her phrasing, but she is chancellor, and as such a "constitutional body", so she has to choose her words with care when speaking as one of the highest german representatives. And unter the German Basic Law there can be no "joy" for the death of another person, it's as simple as that.
21:38 May 4, 2011 by Katzerina
I'm not sure what the references to WWII have to do with anything either... this thread has seriously run it's course.

I don't think anyone rational is actually saddened by the demise of OBL....

but let's stop throwing food at each other while invoking conspiracy theories.
21:42 May 4, 2011 by Major-General Sir Binden-Blood
Oh Boo Hoo who gives a damn about the terrorist Bin Laden? Gunned down like the dog he was! Live by the sword die by the sword! Got what he deserved! Good riddance to bad rubbish! Merkel was right!
21:46 May 4, 2011 by tcall
I think the WWII references are a result of American's being tired of being asked to solve the world's problems and then, when things aren't done in a way that makes everybody happy, are vilified. America is not perfect but, German's, of all people, should not question American resolve and comittment to justice.
21:48 May 4, 2011 by Youhavetobekidding
Shoot-on-sight became the law of the land when Obama was sworn in and declared that his first order of business would be to close Gitmo. For those of you who are still ¦quot;confused¦quot;, you can¦#39;t close Gitmo and take prisoners. Maybe that¦#39;s why Obama has ¦quot;issues¦quot; like many of you confused people out there who championed him into office.

Even though Obama has seen the light, I¦#39;m still waiting for one of you whiners out there to volunteer to be on the jury…… I¦#39;m waiting… That¦#39;s right; it¦#39;s amazing when reality steps in and messes up your little fantasy land.

I don¦#39;t see a German jumping up in the air saying we¦#39;ll take these animals, pay for the $200MM+ in security and court costs, much less have them confined in your back yard while being broadcast on global tv networks for years.

I wish you people would get out of fantasy land and back into reality. I use to believe there was a difference between France and Germany.
21:48 May 4, 2011 by missyE
The worlds' a better place ohne bin Laden!

I am not American - but that was a job well done. I cannot stomach these bickering German 'christian' politicians.. I mean really for them to say -

killing anyone, even a terrorist, ¦quot;can never be cause for joy for a Christian.¦quot;

How stupid is that... do these same Christians not celebrate the killing of Goliath by David (in the Bible). David killed Goliath (or maybe they wanted that he should have only wounded him; to enable a trial to be held).

I am Christian and growing up we sang (and even danced to) songs of joy celebrating the killing of Goliath, and the triumph of good over evil. And now come these wimps (sad apologists) in the form of weak German politicians who hardly understand the Bible but are confused because they simply want to be 'correct'. FOOLS!

Well done Merkel - say it as it is!
21:50 May 4, 2011 by euskept
Comment removed by The Local for breach of our terms.
21:54 May 4, 2011 by melbournite
@missyE "Thou shalt not kill"
21:58 May 4, 2011 by ChrisRea
@ tcall

Are you serious when you say that the US is asked to solve the world's problem? Who did that? US, as any other country, always pursues only their interest.

And who said that it is Germans that question the American approach? I would guess that the membership of this community is made of more non-Germans than Germans. And anyway, I thought it is not the nationality, race, age, social and financial status that matters, but the validity of the point raised that really matters.
22:00 May 4, 2011 by Nina Williams
Hmmm, to all those saying that he should have had a trial you are absolutely right. In fact let's take it a step further...since there is no way he could have had a fair trial with an unbiased jury in the US, nor the Middle East, perhaps we could have had the trial here in Germany. This would have been the best thing Germany could have done to help the US since accepting the more than 300 innocent prisoners in Guantanamo Bay to help close that torture facility down...
22:04 May 4, 2011 by akw
The US was under no obligation to arrest and try bin Laden. He formally declared war on the US - TWICE - in 1996 and 1998. He attacked US civilians and military assets over and over again with vicious terrorist attacks carried out by the organization he lead, and took credit for it every damn time. The US was at war with him, and still is at war with the terrorist organization he founded, al-Qaeda.
22:10 May 4, 2011 by melbournite
@akw Even wars have a legal process. Didnt you ever hear of the Geneva convention? You can poo-poo that if you like, but then that puts you on the same level as the terrorists
22:14 May 4, 2011 by Major-General Sir Binden-Blood
what they should have done the USA was dragged Bin laden alive to New York and build an old style hangmans gibbet and hang him in front of the families of those who died in the twin towers,at ground zero.
22:27 May 4, 2011 by Ranterdon
"most German political figures said they were relieved bin Laden would no longer be stirring up trouble"

Stirring up trouble is what he did? I am VERY GLAD HE'S DEAD.
22:31 May 4, 2011 by Major-General Sir Binden-Blood
@ Nina Williams! There were NO innocent poeople at Guantanemo bay! They were ALL guilty! They were ALL terrorists!
22:42 May 4, 2011 by Thorsten
@Americans, who call us pussies

We will see, who is a pussy, when there is a real war. It does not take much courage to fight deluded islamists and invade primitive countries without military or discipline. Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya are not real wars, the death rate is too low.

When the military bishops critisize Merkel, because it is antichristian and immoral to be "happy about someone's death" then this has nothing to do with being a pussy, but with religion and honor codes for politians.


It was a show trial. And many other crimes were not punished in any way. Who wins a war, kills the leaders of the other side.

If the US put UBL on a trial, then some islamist will take hostages and demand freedom or UBL would use the trial for his propaganda. Why bother about this nonsense? Just kill him.
22:59 May 4, 2011 by ChrisRea
I cannot agree more with Major-General Sir Binden-Blood. ALL detainees at Guantanamo Bay were and are terrorists. For example Khaled Masri, German citizen. His name is proof enough. Here is his story: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/12/03/AR2005120301476.html.

Wait, the US Ambassador at that time said that the guy was wrongfully imprisoned. Oops! Fortunately, the detainees are not treated like humans, so it is easy to hide most errors like that. If Bush says it is good to have Guantanamo Bay, then it must be like that. After all, we know from Nixon that 'When the President does it that means it is NOT illegal'.

Or is it actually something wrong with the very principle of Guantanamo Bay?
23:01 May 4, 2011 by TheCrownPrince
@Thorsten #84

I'm really sorry, but you are wrong again: the "rule of law" is no "nonsense" (as you like to call it) but a civilizing achievement of the highest degree. It helps you from being stoned by a mob or from being locked in a dark cell with the key being thrown away.

"Just kill him" therefore means acting on the same level as the terrorists, I am afraid to say. Unfortunately I guess you don't even unterstand what I am trying to tell you, as your comments are self-explanatory.

But you have a point: if he had been put on trial, what about hostages and new attacks to get him free? Well, this would have been the risks to be taken by all of us in order to live up to our own standards. We simply can't kill someone only because a trial would be too "troublesome" or "wearisome". And when you don't stick to your principles dealing with the "big issues", what about the "small issues" then? A splendid chance to show western superiority at it's best - thrown away.
23:02 May 4, 2011 by finanzdoktor
For those of you who like to quote the seventh commandment "Thou shalt not kill," the word "kill" is correctly translated into "murder." According to a law dictionary, murder is defined as the "unlawful killing of another human being with malice aforethought." First, the actions taken were not unlawful, and second, there was no malice aforethought.
23:06 May 4, 2011 by Major-General Sir Binden-Blood
@ Chris Rea they were all terrorists everyone knows it! All are guilty!
23:57 May 4, 2011 by Nina Williams
@Major-General Sir Binden-Blood...please recognize sarcasm when you read it...for all Germany's posturing about the innocent tortured at Guanatanamo Bay, when it was time to put their country where there mouth was and do the civilized thing and accept these "innocent civilians" for asylum, all Germany would accept of the more than 300 were...2. Even though it would have been dangerous for these people to return to their own countries, Thomas Maziere said at the time that Germany would not accept terrorists.
23:59 May 4, 2011 by Smuggler
@Thorsten, I hope you are not calling out the USA when it comes to war. I believe this country has proved itself more than capable many times.


"Well, this would have been the risks to be taken by all of us in order to live up to our own standards. We simply can't kill someone only because a trial would be too "troublesome" or "wearisome"."

So you would rather risk your countrymen and other innocents being kidnapped and having their heads chopped off on film for all to see than preventing that from happening by putting one bullet in the head of someone who absolutely deserves it and is going to end up that way anyway? It is a moral dilemma, but we should protect our own rights and the rights of our countrymen before we extend the same courtesy to someone this evil.
00:08 May 5, 2011 by Logic Guy
Well, the truth is, it would have been beneficial, in several ways, to have brought Bin Laden to America alive.

* We need to gain a better understanding as to who Al Quaeda is, their objective and why they are so committed to violence.

*There is a huge lack of trust, between the American people and their government. It was an excellent opportunity to bridge that gap, as well as eliminate conspiracy theories about Bin Laden.

After the questions, then they could have put him on trial, and used that video in which Bin Laden discusses how he thought the his plan regarding the towers would go.

"Human life is like Physics. Things must happen in a certain way, otherwise there will be problems." AD
00:18 May 5, 2011 by Smuggler
Logic Guy, how much do you think we would actually get out of Bin Laden?

Are you talking about lack of trust between the American and Pakistani governments? If so, maybe it's because they're harboring terrorists. Why should we trust them?

You're not very logical, Logic Guy.
00:26 May 5, 2011 by euskept
Comment removed by The Local for breach of our terms.
00:40 May 5, 2011 by DOZ
Acting like a true Soviet-German.
00:51 May 5, 2011 by Colorado34
TheCrownePrince: I understand your point that law is law and cant be bent, I do undertand this argument. I really doubt when the U.S military arrived the OBL threw his hands up and said I give up, if he did then I could question why they just dont put him in a helicpoter and take him away.

The post I believe was why would people be happy that he is dead, I hope you understand why a lot of people in the U.S and other countries could have an initial reaction of joy over the death of someone who has admitted to planning and assisting in the killing of innocent civilans.

Please answer me why do Euorpeans sit by and watch innocent people in Kosovo, Libya and Africa die and do nothing or arrive extremly late? Is this civilized?
01:43 May 5, 2011 by Aasvogel
The "war on terror" was a fraud from the beginning - according to Dr Steve Pieczenik, alias Dr Jack Ryan. For an entertaining couple of hours (fast-forward through the adverts) - get yourself an Osama cocktail and listen to what he has to say on the subject. Google his name and his interview with Alex Jones. Osama cocktail? A tall shake (sheikh) on lots of ice, two well chosen shots and a splash of water.
01:51 May 5, 2011 by gator52
After 13 years of enthusiastic support for Adolf Hitler and friends, it's nice to see the Germans rediscover ethics and morals. But PLEASE stop projecting your guilt for WW2 onto the United States.
02:12 May 5, 2011 by StressFree
Whatever... I bet that everyone posted complaints about the U.S would move to the State in heart beat if given the chance.
02:22 May 5, 2011 by AlanBecker
Good Grief, what has happened to Germany? To paraphrase D'Souza, if Bin Laden had antagonized Hitler, he'd be a lampshade by now.
02:45 May 5, 2011 by Colorado34
Post 98,99 and 100, I would think you'll could come up w/something better then this. OBL needed to get killed to send a message, this is war and war is not always pretty. German's and all of Europe lack of action has allowed monsters in Libya, Kosovo and Africa kill literally hundreds of thousands and yet they remain passive, I find this arrogant and their passivity and gaul to criticize the U.S as hypocritical.

Some honestly believe their arguments, which I have no problem w/but their refusal to engage in action to stop the slaughter of innocent people is reprehensible.

To bring back Hitler, or say they want to live in the U.S (have you ever been to Germany the beer is fantastic) is not very creative.
03:50 May 5, 2011 by soahs
When penicillin was discovered, people cheered.

When the Sauk vaccine for Polio was discovered, people cheered.

When the cure for cancer will be discovered people will cheer.

When the cancer of the earth Osama Bin Laden was killed - even the angels cheered.
03:52 May 5, 2011 by Gardis - USA

What has happened to your once great nation? Reading these comments I have to wonder if you have been completely hobbled by your insane political correctness....."knock on his door and arrest him...." w..t.......? Are u serious? You are a sad, pathetic excuse of a nation if you cannot see that Osama was a present threat to the American people. By the way, Germany, how many combatants housed in Guantanamo Bay have you offered to take from the USA? Being that you are such bleeding hearts for the terrorist, have you offered? I didn't think so. Also, if we HAD captured Osama, or if we capture Dr. Zawahiri (next target according to Panetta), are you willing to house him/them on German soil until such time as America cna try them? No, I didnt' think so either. You are a sad and pathetic excuse of a nation if you cannot see true evil that Osama bin Laden represents.
06:26 May 5, 2011 by SirGareth
RE: "Thank-you for a small voice of sanity. There is a very good reason why presumption of innocence and the rule of Law are essential to a civilized society."

Yes it is but war is actually a hiatus from civilization where we send our young in to kill and be killed even if they would rather play with the x-box.

I think you place far too much faith in the law. Its a very limited tool, generally the people who do the most successful butchery on the battlefield always make the laws and the laws they make are never intended to circumscribe their own activities.

RE: "It takes a special type of barbarism to crow over an extra-judicial murder and then claim that God gave you the strength to do it. "Thou shalt not kill", hypocrites"

I'm not sure what you are getting at would intra-judicial murder be more satisfying for you?

As for God, I don't see anyone invoking the deity for either executions

or taxation - they're both just government thingies.

Finally killing and muder are not the same; the commandment has been mis-translated form "thou shalt not murder"

"We kilt Osama - we dint murder him.".
08:06 May 5, 2011 by CubanEyes
Of course many in Germany don't feel it's appropriate to be cheering over Bin Laden's death, because it was not Germany or its people was attacked or killed on 9/11. Bin Laden and his ilk are a cesspool of hate, they revel in the killing of innocent people, in using children and women as human shields. al-Qaida and Bin Laden are roaches, and roaches must be exterminated before they continue to multiply and spread their disease. If anything else comes out of this is that these roaches can run but they can't hide. It's a small world, and we will find you, even if a foreign country is harboring you. So watch you backs al-Qaida. al-Qaida awoke a sleeping giant in the American's resolve not to be victims of these freaks of nature. I am with Merkel...I am happy Bin Laden has been killed. God Bless the USA!
08:14 May 5, 2011 by melbournite
there you go @finanzdoktor you can do the weasley lawyer routine when pressed. I look forward to God being called as a witness on the court case about the seventh commandment. I note you categorising of the killing of OBL as "not unlawful". Unless there is some grey area between "not unlawful" and "lawful" (like that between not pregnant and pregnant) that I dont know of it, then you must know some new laws that noone else does. Lets just pick one. Do you know what Sovereignty is? Unless Pakistan is Soverign US territory then I suspect you will have a hard time defending on that point alone
08:15 May 5, 2011 by OsamasPajamas
Comment removed by The Local for breach of our terms.
08:55 May 5, 2011 by Sooney
Since every country has their own terroist problems - I find it amazing that some politicians can carry on the way they do - this is something that was taken cared of by the Americans for the Americans - and oh by the way - they did not say they were irradicating world terrorism - they eliminated a criminal who not only killed thousands of Americans - but also thousands of other innocent people - hats off to Die Welt for getting it! So try doing something instead of critizing - just my thoughts!

The right-wing Die Welt wrote that bin Laden's death was a hugely important symbol. It was necessary to rob bin Laden of his aura of invulnerability and demonstrate to the world that America remains strong.

¦quot;America has once again powerfully demonstrated with the death of bin Laden that one cannot go unpunished for attacking and humiliating the USA. America has shown that it doesn¦#39;t forget. And that it commands the resources, the technology, the courage and the readiness to pursue offenders tirelessly and seize them at a great distance.¦quot;

It also praised Obama¦#39;s careful avoidance of triumphalism.

¦quot;In words that would never come from the lips of a German politician, he justified the death of a man from the sphere of America¦#39;s values. No talk of revenge, but a clear signal that one indivisible nation is so sacred to Americans that they will always defend it pragmatically ­ the pilgrims aren¦#39;t supposed to have fled Europe¦#39;s despots for nothing.¦quot;

The world has often felt that the US has got most things wrong since September 11, 2001 ­ notably the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. But things look a little different today, the paper argued.

The uprisings in Tunisia, Egypt, Libya, Bahrain and Syria ­ perhaps helped by the downfall of Iraq's Saddam Hussein ­ defy the old pessimism that the Middle East was a choice between fanatical theocrats and secular autocrats
10:10 May 5, 2011 by T.J. Morton
@ChrisRea, your statement is only partly true:

A relevant quote for the article, incorrectly attributed to Martin Luther King Jr.:

"I mourn the loss of thousands of precious lives, but I will not rejoice in the death of one, not even an enemy. Returning hate for hate multiplies hate, adding deeper darkness to a night already devoid of stars. Darkness cannot drive out darkness: only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate: only love can do that."

The last three lines are correctly attributed. However, the first line is from someone who quoted Dr. King along with her own statement.

12:18 May 5, 2011 by tallady
melbournite just a note about "presumed Innocent" that vanished some years ago in the Federal justice system ,,it is now "Presumed Guilty". you would have to prove your innocence against what the Gov, would call a preponderance of evidence.Good luck if you ever get a federal indictment 98% are convicted.

Osama bin Laden's al-Qaida network managed to inflict on our country the worst single attack on US soil since Pearl Harbor good riddens. and justice has prevailed.
12:47 May 5, 2011 by Tatarewicz
The "killing" of bin Laden was a publicity stunt serving two main purposes. Firstly, it enhances Israel's security by discouraging Arabs from helping Palestinians get back lands stolen by Israeli terrorists to form their illegal state. Usama was encouraging this kind of help and his "assassination" is an illustration of what happens to such helpers.

Secondly, by using American military to eliminate an Israeli adversary Obama and supporting members of Congress are assured of continued support from Organized Jewry at election time, support which is indispensable for success at the polls. The following illustrates the thankfulness and loyalty members of Congress display towards Israel and the Israeli lobby for its election help in the form of funding, media and organizational support:


In an interview published in Karachi"s Ummat 2001-09-28, bin Laden said that neither he nor the Al-Quaidah group had anything to do with the 11 September attacks on the USA. He went on to suggest that Jews or US secret services were behind the attacks..."As a Muslim, I try my best to avoid telling a lie. I had no knowledge of these attacks, nor do I consider the killing of innocent women, children and other humans as an appreciable act.


While bin Laden was opposed to America protecting Israel while it's stealing land from from Palestinians and killing them it makes no sense for him to organize an attack on America and not claim credit for it (so that America would get the message to stop aiding Israeli criminals). The FBI admitted it had no hard evidence of Usama's complicity in 9/11.

Perhaps a third reason a big splash is being made about bin Laden's "demise" is to counter a growing movement on the part of professionals and other US groups to reopen investigations into 9/11 to determine the real instigators and implementers of it and how it was that Israel and its duals benefited so much from it. An alive Usama might offer evidence which would be embarrassing to the US-Israeli cause and thus undermine Israel's shaky position. And of course it takes the focus off Palestine where Israeli terrorists just keep taking more land from the indigenous Arabs.
13:01 May 5, 2011 by Sooney
How did Martin Luther King get in the conversation -
13:25 May 5, 2011 by mso88
The comments by Merkel's critics are both shocking and chilling. Further, the veiled anti-Semitism among so many of these German posters is especially ominous as it hints at unresolved, deep-seated German pathological impulses...a can of worms that can opened later. The fact remains that the US has heroically rid the world of a monstrous mass-murderer, with far more humanity and respect than he deserved. And for that, Chancellor Merkel was correct in her very muted (actually timid) response.
14:21 May 5, 2011 by Tom_in_KY
Thank God for the Internet. Thank God for the insight it provides and for the occasional epiphany, like my own this morning. Thanks to this story for instance I now fully understand WHY my ancestors left Europe to come to America, and exactly WHO it was they left behind. Thank you so very much. Maybe you should look into Angie's birth certificate and make sure she's pure, she might have realtives in Kansas or someplace awful like that. It would just be so cool to have "friends" who have our back the next time we have to rid the world of rubbish like OBL. You know, friends who recognize wrong when they see it and are willing to do something about it.
14:52 May 5, 2011 by jbaker
WOW! Can you imagine if people used the energy they are releasing in all their Hate on their own wellfare they would be worth Millions of Euro's.

Your correct -Tim in KY- Thank GOD for the internet. The News in Main Stream Media is Pre-Planned Junk.
14:56 May 5, 2011 by tallady
Tatarewicz, Thats quite a theory and litany of bullsh1t. That theory would only be believed by the obtuse.
15:56 May 5, 2011 by Sastry.M
Seen from the many above comments the plight of Indian suffering due to terrorist acts never came up for discussion. Every one expects justification for his/her opinions but none to recognize the Indian cause.Many hundreds were killed in terrorist attacks all over India and the most horrible on a hotel in Bombay on 27'th Nov 2008. Even with clear evidence of records submitted to both the U.S and Pakistan the U.S is preaching patience and Pakistan is unable to act decisively because of 'lack' of sufficient evidence.

This 26/11 attack would have faded into attrition with impotent diplomatic overtures by Indian politicians.However it caught attention due to a curious incident,namely the death of a Rabbi's son and daughter-in-law stationed in the hotel and killed by terrorists leaving an orphaned child to the care of grandfather and who was saved by a Christian nurse attending the baby. The incident was widely published in all Indian news papers with large photographs and the Christian nurse given an exclusive merit of recognition by Israel.

Now on date with the covert American operation killing the No1 enemy Terrorist right inside a million dollar mansion of built specifically by another terrorist group and located near a military academy cantonment at Abbotabad in Pakistan taken as the most trusted U.S friend in the fight against terrorism (FAT) in the region with fat multi billion dollar support NOTHING APPARENTLY HAS CHANGED. The bold letters express only my meek opinion as an Indian and so known for in general but Not the ground realities.

Terminating the physical apparition of a terrorist like OBL does not obliterate the subtle cause of inspiration or the conviction of faith for extremism to bring about a sense of proportion and rationality among the destitute people at large.

Let all the forum friends as above consider the confusion and complexity whipped up by the American covert action in getting rid of her enemy. As on date the U.S as said by Hilary Clinton still considers Pakistan as a trusted friend in FAT although the temporary embarrassing situation developed in consequence could be remedied by consultation. Because India preached penance and spirituality to the world she is asked to practice the same with forbearance to double speak and standards probably required to effectively implement Fat which need not bother meek friendships with timid people.

Germany always truly appreciated Indian heritage and maintained consistent foreign policy toward India. Whatever the angle she is looked at and described by her western colleagues the explanation @#111 by Tatarewicz appears more pertinent because of a shroud of secrecy ascribed to all events concerning the great U.S achievement to be laid openly bare to the world but kept concealed with wavering minds as if it has the exclusive rights of priority only restricted to internal policies of White House Governance and their chosen few directives.
18:25 May 5, 2011 by TheCrownPrince
I highly recommend a commentary in the FAZ (not known as leftist scrap paper) of today, titled: "Even terrorists have rights" and written by a professional judge and law professer. He states that - as by common standards of international law there can be no "state of war" between the US and the Al Qaida-organization, because the latter is no sufficient party for this - the killing of Bin Laden only would have been justified in case of self-defense, which was obviously never the case, because OBL was unarmed and at no time of the operation a serious threat to any SEALS-soldier involved.

Thus, the killing was not "justice" in the narrow (legal) sense of the word. Maybe it was "justice" in a wider, allegorical sense, but this is certainly too wide a field...
20:45 May 5, 2011 by melbournite
@TheCrownPrince I actually think the US gvt did its own citizens a great disservice by not putting OBL on trial. He was not the devil incarnate after all, but a man with nutty ideas, but a man nontheless. There is nothing to lose by going via the normal course of the Law, except the truth, and perhaps that was the whole point of the mafia-type hit.

As far as the effect of OBL's death on the current Arab revolutions - it will have precisely zero effect - perhaps even a beneficial effect. Revolutionary Egypt is already well on the way the relieving the siege on Gaza and recognising a Palestinian state
21:01 May 5, 2011 by Masmuka
I am as happy as Frau Merkel about Bin Laden's death and God Bless America....
22:53 May 5, 2011 by Gabriel Grubb
Merkel was not right here! Bin Laden should have been kept alive and dragged to New York in chains! Then hung by the neck until death, at Ground Zero ,in front of all the relatives of all the people who died in the Twin Towers!
01:15 May 6, 2011 by Logic Guy
Well, I admit that I should have been more clear in my first comment.

I meant to say that there is a profound lack of trust between the United States government and the citizens of the United States.

Every healthy relationship of every kind is based upon trust. Without trust you have nothing. A large percentage of humanity lies and pretends. Therefore it is often difficult to make an accurate distinction between perception and the truth.

People tend to believe things that they can actually see.
01:19 May 6, 2011 by Paul -Indiana
Concerning the death of UBL, good riddance.
02:14 May 6, 2011 by tercel
I am absolutely amazed at all the greens and leftists and "the rule of law must not be broken" people posting here. So many post that bin Laden should have been arrested and faced trial for his crimes. Fine, he NEVER would have gotten a fair trial in the US, NEVER gotten a fair trial in any moslem country. That only leaves Europe, and how about having the trial in Germany? I am sure you could afford the cost (in euros) of the trial. But what happens when bin Laden's followers don't want a trial and want him set free? Now as far as I can tell there is NO proof that bin Laden actually physically killed anyone. Now you have the Demjanjuk problem, (you gave a get out of jail free pass to all german nazis) but this 90 year old Ukrainian who even the Israelis say his ID card is a Russian forgery, you want to hang (literally) for 28,000 deaths in a concentration camp that no one can put him in and no one can prove he physically killed anyone. Can you really get a conviction on bin Laden?

Now back to bin Laden's followers. Say they kidnap some German tourists or business men. And for every day bin Laden is not set free 5 Germans will be killed (say like Daniel Pearl), now splashed across your TV screen or on youtube you see bin Laden's followers slowly cutting off the heads of these innocent Germans all screaming for mercy (and for you to release bin laden) while their killers shout, allah akbar! allah akbar! How many Germans will you watch die this way? 5, maybe 15? Would you actually have the intestinal fortitude and convictions of your beliefs of adhering to the rule of law to watch as many as 50 die before you released bin Laden, and YOU WOULD have release him there is no doubt about that.

So now how are the standards of a civilized democratic society upheld? "bin laden should have been brought to trial, if at all possible. We as western civilization simply don't have the right to disregard the rule of law, how extraordinary the single case may be." Hypocrites, you would have caved to terrorists after watching innocent Germans killed like sheep just like the Spanish did when the terrorists blew up some trains.

He is DEAD and the civilized world is better off without him.
06:42 May 6, 2011 by melbournite
@tercel listen to yourself... if a man cant get a fair trial and there is no evidence against him we should just have him bumped off? What you are saying is that the legal system doesnt work and that people should take the law into their own hands and kill anyone they are suspicious of - like the Pediatrician in the UK who was attacked by a mob because they confused the name with Pedophile. They should have strung the Pediatrician up on the spot and justice would have been served?

Ah but u say, even if there was no evidence against OBL then we should consider him a special case because he was such a figure of hate. Then who decides who are the special cases for the death squad? The President? The military? A senate sub-committee? Why dont we just kill everyone in Guantanamo tonight instead of wasting our time torturing them some more
07:55 May 6, 2011 by mbridges
Anyone wanting to know the full story on the death of Osama bin Laden should listen to the following interview of Dr. Steve Pieczenik by Alex Jones on his Youtube channel. Dr. Steve Pieczenik's credentials are Deputy Assistant Secretary of State and/or Senior Policy Planner under secretaries of state, Kissinger, Vance, Schultz and Baker. I do not want to be rejected as link spam so I will only give you part of the first link. There are seven parts to the interview and it can be found in full at the Alex Jones Channel at Youtube.
17:58 May 6, 2011 by MarshaLynn
Not jump for joy that a mass murderer has been eliminated? How silly. Listen up, liberals/progressives. Your high-minded theorizing is silly, inane, and dangerous. It will get us all killed. Your feet do not touch the ground at any point, nor is your brain connected to reality. I mean that quite literally. Your utopian ideals do not match reality and cannot stand up to earth-based testing. You have to deal with this world as it really is, not as you wish it to be. On this side of eternity, human beings will never become the angels you want them to be. It is against human nature and just will NOT happen, not now, not ever.
18:30 May 6, 2011 by tercel

I see you read what you think you see and ignore the rest. Apparently you have never been in a court. The defense is there to get their client off, it doesn't matter if the accused is 100% guilty. OBL's backers would have paid for the best lawyers in Germany, one tacit I know they would have used is "you can't prove my client physically killed anyone". The fact that he "ordered" the deaths of thousands would have been buried under the defense teams legal twisting and turning and b.s..

The main part of my post is that OBL would NEVER have gone to trial. His followers would have insured that - read my post again to see why Germany would not have the intestinal fortitude to see the trial through to the end. His followers would have most definitely done what I posted, they have in the past and will do so in the future.

I did make one mistake, Demjanjuk's Id card is a Russian forgery even the Israelis say it but you want to hang him FIGURATIVELY, (you have no death penalty in Germany), so that should make you feel better about all those killed by Germany in WW2.

Also the leftist canard about torturing prisoners at gitmo is getting a bit old. It has been proven by independant non biased sources that the prisoners at gitmo are treated better than prisoners in German jails (actually they said European jails But Germany is still part of Europe.)
18:55 May 6, 2011 by Misterbee
Well, I told myself I would refrain from commenting on this article. I fail to see where Chancellor Merkel was expressing "joy" over bin Laden's death. I got the impression she was expressing something more akin to the relief one might feel when hearing that a rabid animal had been killed. But the comment from "melbournite" changed that. "...presumption of innocence and the rule of Law are essential to a civilized society." Yes. But when you a have mass-murderer or a serial killer who enjoys "...crow[ing]...over an extra-judicial murder and then claim that God gave you the strength to do it." - which bin Laden had done - I fail to see why you need the theatrics of a trial. Mass murderers and serial killers have not only forfeited the benefits of a civilized society, they are actively engaged in its destruction.

As for your reference to "Thou shalt not kill", hypocrites" I presume you are making reference to Exodus 20:13 (NKJV) "You shall not murder. You may try reading more of The Book than one badly translated passage. Find the Book of Exodus, locate the 21st chapter, 12th verse. There you will see the following:

12 "He who strikes a man so that he dies shall surely be put to death.

13 However, if he did not lie in wait, but God delivered him into his hand, then I will appoint for you a place where he may flee.

14 "But if a man acts with premeditation against his neighbor, to kill him by treachery, you shall take him from My altar, that he may die. Exodus 21:12-14 (NKJV)

It would appear that either you or GOD are confused. I've never met you, but I think I know who's confused.
20:06 May 6, 2011 by tallady
Logic Guy,Lets be clear,you do not know much about the American public and it's relationship to it's government.

Trust is less of a problem there than here my good man.
20:57 May 6, 2011 by Chicago1996
I was just taking another sip of my tea when I read that last comment. I almost choked laughing. In terms of a people as a whole trusting their own government, I would say that both Germans and Americans are on equal footing on that one. Both don't trust their government - no matter who is / was / or will be in office. Must run in the family, since we are cousins and all... ;)
21:41 May 6, 2011 by Flint
@ tatarewicz.

If mankind could harness energy equivalent to the width, breadth, and depth of your profound stupidity, we would not need oil.
21:53 May 6, 2011 by Misterbee
tallady -

Don't know about you, but I trust the foundation of my Representative Republic. I have some small degree of trust for my elected representation. I just don't trust the out-of-control, power-hungry bureaucratic socialists who seem to infest almost every level of government. Perhaps if we just refuse to pay them anymore, they will find actual employment in a line of work that produces something besides more stupid regulations.
00:46 May 7, 2011 by DrGideonPolya
Merkel's comment is morally wrong and reveals technical incompetence. The proper judicial trial of alleged perpetrators is not just about punishment it is vitally important to establish the facts of the alleged crimes in order to make society safer. The extra-judicial murder of Osama by the Americans and the rapid disposal of his body has further blocked proper judicial investigation of 9-11. We do not know of Osamarole in 9-11 - we are just fed relentless US propaganda. However his murder makes Obama and his associates unrepentant murderers and accessories after the act of the 9-11 atrocity.

Osama's wives, children and associates and Pakistani ISI operatives can potentially tell us who did or didn't do 9-11and the circumstances of Osama's murder. Further, Professor Niels Harrit (University of Copenhagen) has published a peer-reviewed paper in a chemical physics journal presenting compelling evidence for unexploded nanothermite high explosive in all WTC dust samples examined i.e. further damning evidence that the Bush-Obama "official story" is a lie and that the US did 9-11 as asserted by many science, engineering , military and intelligence experts (for a detailed compendium of such authoritative opinions Google "US did 9-11").

Osama the terrorist was America's most valuable "asset" for 30 years. Osama was US-backed in the war against the Russians in Afghanistan (that ultimately led to Russian defeat, the fall of Communism and the dismemberment of the Soviet Empire). Post-cold war Osama's terrorist agenda (hundreds of Westerners killed) was exploited by vastly more deadly US state terrorism (millions of people killed by the US including the 3,000 American killed by the US Government on 9-11) which made him a bogeyman in Western propaganda akin to Emmanuel Goldstein in George Orwell's novel "1984".

Obama, the world's worst terrorist today, has just murdered America's most valuable "asset" for 30 years for reasons of political popularity and expediency.
08:46 May 7, 2011 by tercel

Come on EVERYONE who knows ANYTHING about explosives KNOWS thermite DOES NOT explode. Nanothermite is just slightly finer granules of thermite and it also can not explode. Professor Niels Harrit might be a very nice professor but as an explosive expert he is out of his field.

"The 9/11 truther idea is that the plane did in fact strike the tower, but the collapse was initiated by thermite. This doesn't hold much water, since the impact of the crash would have obliterated the triggering mechanism for any thermite that was clandestinely placed there. (The other, more sensible alternative, is that Steven Jones' "iron microspheres" are an expected result of the cataclysm - and not an indication that thermite was used.)

Also 'Thermite' or 'nanothermite' requires a consistant high temperature (such as a blow torch) to ignite. It is notoriously unpredictable, difficult to ignite and control. Thin layers painted on would not be sufficient. Bags and bags (hundreds of pounds) of the stuf would have to packed around each column and at specific sites on every floor. All this without some office workers noticing?

"In an effort to confirm the claims being made about thermite and nanothermite, T. Mark Hightower, a chemical engineer from both the space program and chemical industry, decided to investigate its use as an explosive. As Hightower observed to Gage, however: ¦quot;This paper offers no evidence to me that explosive velocities anywhere near that of TNT (22,600 feet per second) can be produced by the nanothermites as described and presented. On page 10, it states, ¦#39;One limitation inherent in any thermite energetic material is the inability of the energetic material to do pressure/volume work on an object. Thermites release energy in the form of heat and light, but are unable to move objects.¦#39;"

During the US civil war Gen. Sherman came across a southern railroad line. He had the RR ties dug up and started a bon fire with them, he then had the RR track put in the fire and when they were red to white hot had 6 men (3 on each side) wrap blankets around the ends and walk over to a telegraph pole and BEND the RR track into a U shape. The heat of the jet fuel did the same to the support beams of the WTC. The weight of hundreds of tons of the floors above the crash zone caused the support beams to give and as the upper floors came down they sheared off the support bolts holding up the lower floors and the WTC came down.

The 9/11 truthers don't mention the floors above the crash zone and never mention the WTC was open 24/7/365 with thousands of workers working 2nd and 3rd shift. And not one of these workers saw tons of explosives being planted by men in black suits? Believe your myths and fantasies if you want, the US government did not bring down the WTC.

Osama the terrorist was NOT America's most valuable "asset" for 30 years, he was Pakistans ISI most valuable "asset" for 30 years.
11:50 May 7, 2011 by Cazkey
This is for chicago1996. I want to thank you sir for your views. I am an American living in Germany for the past 7.5 years and your opinion was right on. I do not agree with killing people. Life is precious, but when someone continually crosses the line and kills thousands indescrimantely the only law they respect is that of violence. We as a world have a duty to protect ourselves from those who kill. It is easy to judge a people and condem their actions when they themselves have no experience with that people. I can tell your comments have a American influence to it and I just want to say thank you.
10:09 May 8, 2011 by Tatarewicz
Tallady, First: What I need is not typical troll-like personal attacks but rather your best rationale explaining why my hypothesis is wrong, particularly what facts/assumptions you can disprove (and how).

The spectacle of ghoulish "crowds" in the Jewish "capital" of America cheering and gloating over Usama's "demise" tends to support my contention that Israel is the hidden key player in this propaganda production. Further supported by Jewish talking heads and scribes in North America's (Jewish-controlled) mainstream media rabidly condemning Usama even though war hawk Dick Cheney contended: We've never made the case, or argued...that somehow Osama Bin Laden was directly involved in 9-11."


So once again it looks like we have the real culprit (for world-wide turmoil) hiding in the woodpile...and this time he ain't no nigger.
10:00 May 9, 2011 by Sooney
my my - testy aren't we - I am so glad that there were spectacle crowds acknowledging the end of a chapter in US History with celebrations in the streets - and the name of that chapter was Osama Bin Laden - the real culprit for world wide turmoil, not Isarel, not the jews, not African Americans, just plain old Americans.
15:48 May 10, 2011 by Beachrider
OBL conceded his role in the Civilian mass murder in 2001. Anyone that doesn't believe that is just in all kinds of denial. No lies from your hated Americans are involved. This claim is more about your hate then OBL. Don't be a hater.

If the International courts wanted to try OBL, they could have started it with an arraignment. Given his public statements, arraignment could have been done in absentia. That would have, at least, resulted in an international bench warrant. None of that happened. No one wanted to take on the issue. So that wasn't about your hated Americans, either.

Left to do it alone, the USA did. I read a lot here about non-engage-ment resulting in enrage-ment. There is room for action. But this passive-aggressive bullcrap just means people just-watch while others attack the problems.

Too bad.
11:02 February 5, 2012 by Yah right
Too bad George Bush wasn't in the house with OBL.
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