• Germany edition
Society
Photo: DPA

Third Reich job comparison grounds for termination, court rules

Published: 19 Jan 11 11:11 CET | Print version
Online: http://www.thelocal.de/society/20110119-32521.html

Disgruntled employees in Germany who compare conditions at their workplace to the Third Reich can be justifiably fired, according to a Hessian labour court ruling published on Wednesday.

The court rejected an appeal by a 47-year-old company driver who sued his employer of 30 years after he was fired for doing just that.

Before the court, the complainant expressed his opinion once again, saying his employer was a liar and had treated people in such a way that it was like working in “the Third Reich.”

According to the verdict, strong insults made by employees about their employer are grounds for termination. The right to free speech does not extend to verbal assaults on human dignity or defamatory statements, the court said.

Previous insults made by the 47-year-old about the court, which he called “corrupt” and “worse than the communists,” were also taken into account by the judge.

DAPD/ka

What do you think? Leave your comment below.


Your comments about this article:

11:46 January 19, 2011 by marimay
I have to agree this seems very china-like.
11:50 January 19, 2011 by auniquecorn
Yep, He should of just taken his medicine like a good german boy and kept his mouth shut. You can´t beat the system.

And the gall to call the court corrupt. Tsk tsk.
12:20 January 19, 2011 by michael4096
I have to agree this seems very china-like.
Really? You think that a judge would act this way if he was publicly accused of being corrupt in China? Or, in most other countries, come to that - "contempt of court" comes to mind, but I'm not a lawyer
13:10 January 19, 2011 by marimay
Potentially vengeful judgments? Yeah, really.
14:30 January 19, 2011 by storymann
maybe it would have gone down different if he had made the analogy, it's like working for a slave driver...but maybe not.....
16:28 January 19, 2011 by maxbrando
A "star chamber" proceeding?? Well, you gotta' start somewhere, even if it is only a driver.
16:57 January 19, 2011 by bernie1927
Suing the company for dismissing him is rather odd. Comparison with the third Reich was his mistake. If he had compared with the communists or the devil or whatever, that would have been okay but to compare with the third Reich, my God, that can not be tolerated even though working conditions for a driver were probably better during the time of the third Reich and corruption was a lot less.
17:45 January 19, 2011 by teutonic-knight
@ marimay, I think you are a mongol. I am right?
18:19 January 19, 2011 by michael4096
@bernie1927 - almost, but incomplete..

you can also be summararily dismissed for racial slurs. So comparison with the devil, ok. But, comparison with, say, taliban is a bit iffy - wouldn't like to try it myself

personnaly, I find it all ok - at least everybody knows what constitutes an insult and most are ok with that from both sides - better than most countries
18:38 January 19, 2011 by Landmine
It's a free country, go get another job... Who would ever want to go back to a job where they don't want you there anyways?
18:43 January 19, 2011 by teutonic-knight
I think the managers did a mistake. The businesses and companies should try to create job for their fellow countrymen.
19:59 January 19, 2011 by fryintl
Freedom of Speech. I think he had to watch his mouth when speaking of the court, as a beamter can never be portrayed accurately if the portrayal is anything less than complimentary.

As for comparing the work place to teh Third Reich, it is funny he can't say that. He may have to have a better wording in any legal argument, but if he can't express his opinion, then where is the freedom to speak? I see more of the same coming, and more oppression, and then people will see that socialism is just another spelling of communism and the all powerful government and teh underpowered people...until the next revolution that will come when people are tired of Beamters taking away their rights.

And isn't it great how most people are ok with the court telling the guy he has no right to express his true opinion? I mean, did his comment cause them harm in selling their product? Did they lose sleep? Will they not be able to look themselves in teh mirror without shuttering? Redonkulous...
20:28 January 19, 2011 by michael4096
@marimay, fryintl - beamter? a judge? Contempt of court?

Anywhere else you would be locked up with a missing key.
02:14 January 20, 2011 by blockhaus
words should never be made illegal....you should be free to say whatever you like...however,there is another way to look at this story, maybe this chap is a whistle blower and he's just uncovered a secret fourth reich...[gasp!]
03:20 January 20, 2011 by Gretl
Um, what was the context? Did he say this TO the employer? To the company's customers? To his friends in the pub over a beer? On Facebook?

Sure, he can speak his mind, but depending on where, he could be facing libel charges. As an employer, I would fire someone whose attitude was that poor if they said it to me. If I heard about it on Facebook or someother forum, I'd sue for libel.
07:06 January 20, 2011 by bal00
It seems like a lot of commenters here don't understand how civil liberties work. 'Freedom of speech' means the GOVERNMENT cannot punish you for speaking your mind. It does not mean that an EMPLOYER can't fire you if you talk crap about him.

Likewise, 'freedom of movement' means the government can't tell you where to live or where to travel, but that doesn't mean you can choose not to show up at work, cite freedom of movement and still have a job.

The ruling basically says that a private company can choose to dismiss an employee if they're not happy with him making insulting remarks about the company in public. Common sense, really.
07:25 January 20, 2011 by wood artist
What people often confuse is that the enjoyment of Free Speech also comes with the obligation to enjoy the responsibility for your words. It may be true that you are free to say what you like, but you are also free to enjoy the repercussions of having said them. It seems to me that it's hardly a secret that invoking images, verbal or otherwise, of the Third Reich whilst in Germany is likely to have a disproportionate result. For a German citizen to do so seems like he's just being dumb.

wa
08:23 January 20, 2011 by teutonic-knight
@ wood artist

You said "the enjoyment of Free Speech also comes with the obligation to enjoy the responsibility for your words"

I will say to you, the question is who is to decide what are your responsibilities and what is right or wrong to say.
14:01 January 20, 2011 by KenVdM
Having lived in L.A. for the last two years I'm surprised by what the Americans are writing. They seem completely unaware of how their nation is evolving. Arizona and these gun-toting Americans, shouting 'freedom' every 5 words, claim they are free but they are wholly controlled by the federal government.

Obama and the senate has and continues to block immigration reform, and push other federal powers upon the state of Arizona and other states.

In the U.S. these freedoms mean that I can take a driving test in Mandarin in L.A., and any other language in the world. English is not the only national language in law. It also means I can have a child in the U.S. and they are nearly immediately American. The Hispanic population, many of which speak little English, are growing rapidly. Yet the Americans with their own freedoms, amendments, are utterly powerless to stop them.

Another issue in Arizona is stopping illegals for 'stop and checks' of their papers, again these are cited infringements of people's freedoms. Then all the liberals shout 'Racism' because all the illegals are pretty much dark-skinned.

Germany is not going to fall, but the U.S. with its 14 trillion dollars of debt, rapidly growing immigrant population that is not integrating is eventually going to suffocate itself. The American dream is over, the Americans are split in two extreme halves now. Gun-toting Republicans versus the mix of self-destructive Democrats.

Americans must realise this is the 21st Century, guns mean F-all now, and start voting to repeal some of these so-called freedoms that are now destroying the USA.
18:49 January 20, 2011 by willowsdad
Ken: the US is a nation of immigrants and before it was Latinos it was Germans (among others) who were going to ruin it with their refusal to assimilate and speak English. The country's going to hell, alright, but not because of immigration. I hope you're not still there--the last thing America needs is another bigot.
19:21 January 20, 2011 by tallady
@ KenVdM I do not agree with all you said but the USA is rapidly descending in to 2nd world status for a majority of its citizens, while most of Europe will remain firmly 1st world assuming it doesn't allow itself to become overrun by tens or even hundreds of millions of immigrants as the USA is currently doing. The USA is morphing in to a Latin American-style plutocracy with huge wealth disparities while Europe is becoming ever-more democratic.

@ willowsdad ,,I think immigration is one of the major problems, the Europeans brought excellent work ethics and built America, the arrivals of immigrants these last years have brought the fee loaders..and system degenerate abusers.Talk about language change,, habla espanol?
23:39 January 20, 2011 by LittleSheepCreek
Germany has never had free speech so why is it not like the Third Reich?
18:46 January 21, 2011 by Stephen Goodson
Invoking the Third Reich as a reason or excuse for a point of view is fraught with difficulty. The mainstream understanding of "Nazism" more or less revolves around 66 years of Anglo-American propaganda. (Remember that Germany still does not have a peace treaty). In Germany any serious debate about the merits of National Socialism is muzzled by section 130 of the Criminal Code. Dispute the establishment's version of history and you will along with thousands of others be fined or face imprisonment of upto five years. For the record all trade unions were united into one organization called the Deutsche Arbeitsfront. Workers' rights were protected by a Tribunal of Social Honor, which laid down conditions of employment. These regulations were superior to any comparable legislation in the world at that time. As a result of the harmonious relationship between employer and employee strike action vanished. The taxation of workers, particularly those with families, was sharply reduced. Holiday camps were provided at subsidized rates, while sea trips on large cruise ships were made possible through the Kraft durche Freude - Strength through Joy programme. Married couple received low interest housing loans. For each child born 25% of the loan was cancelled, and if there were four children, the loan would be repaid in full.
20:23 January 21, 2011 by fair1day
According to the verdict, strong insults made by employees about their employer are grounds for termination.

Poor little bus driver.
21:13 January 21, 2011 by derExDeutsche
sounds to me like Stephen Goodson is ready for a 'serious debate about the Merits of National Socialism' lol

What exactly is it about the 'establishment history' that fails us?
03:17 January 22, 2011 by Prufrock2010
@ KenVdM

Having lived in L.A. for the past two years, your ignorance of American constitutional guarantees, government, politics and society is staggering. Do you just watch Fox News all day? Do you ever read a newspaper? Or are you just paid to troll?

Immigration reform was not blocked by Obama, but by the Republicans in the Senate who have filibustered every reform effort, including the "Dream Act." That's because they are indebted to big agribusiness and corporate hospitality interests who prefer to hire undocumented aliens because they don't have to pay them a living wage, provide any benefits for them, and know that they can't complain.

The Arizona immigration law, SB 1070, is unconstitutional on its face because the federal government has the sole authority under the constitution to regulate immigration. It is also violative of federal laws prohibiting racial profiling.

A baby born in the United States by an undocumented mother is automatically an American citizen by virtue of the 14th Amendment, which was ratified immediately following the Civil War.

The 14 or 15 trillion dollars in debt that now saddles the U.S. was created by 8 years of a Republican administration which inherited a surplus, largely by launching two unnecessary wars that weren't paid for and by deregulating the financial industries that led to a global economic meltdown.

What's the use? Go back to watching Sean Hannity and Sarah Palin. With one caveat: visitors to the US such as you should measure your words very carefully when suggesting that Americans relinquish what few constitutional rights they still enjoy.
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