Photo: DPA

Parents will 'drink away' new child care subsidy

Published: 27 Oct 09 17:58 CET
Online: http://www.thelocal.de/society/20091027-22853.html

Heinz Buschkowsky, the mayor of Berlin’s multicultural Neukölln district, tells Sandra Dassler from Berlin daily Der Tagesspiegel why he thinks the German government’s plans to introduce a new “home-care” subsidy for children opting out of day care could have disastrous repercussions.

One of the most controversial policy decisions already made by Chancellor Angela Merkel’s new centre-right coalition is the introduction in 2013 of the so-called Betreuungsgeld, money paid to parents deciding to keep their children out of public day care.

The €150 a month for each child under three years old was a key demand of the CSU, the Bavarian sister party of Merkel’s conservative Christian Democrats, during coalition negotiations. But the subsidy has been dubbed the “stove premium” by critics, who fear it discourages women with children from working. Others, such as Buschkowsky from the centre-left Social Democrats, see it as a threat to efforts to integrate immigrants into German society.


What were your thoughts when you heard about the introduction of the Betreuungsgeld?

That apparently there are still people that just don’t get it. If you want to bolster education-shy parents and decrease the opportunities of their children this is certainly the best way to do it.


Why is that?

Because the lives of the so-called uneducated classes on social welfare benefits will become more comfortable. Children will become an even greater income factor. With other words: (Merkel’s coalition) is preserving the lower classes and at the same time is making youth criminal sentencing laws tougher. That’s a policy of pure cynicism for society.


It sounds as if you’re rather frustrated.

I am, to put it mildly, stunned. Subsidies that keep kids in their own environment rather than have them integrate? This is completely backwards. This proposal ignores the accomplishments of almost all OECD countries and several scientific studies. Experts agree that we have to invest in children and not in their parents. The new coalition is now ruining all that with brute force.


What exactly do you fear most?

That the Betreuungsgeld won’t be spent on supporting and educating the children. Speaking plainly: lower class Germans will drink it away and lower class immigrants will bring over Granny for day care.


Granny doesn’t necessarily have to be bad for kids..

No, but in 99 percent of all cases she unfortunately won’t speak German. Just as little as the parents do. Day care is so important for that reason alone. And it should be as early as possible, because the younger the children are, the easier it is to grow up bilingual.


Can’t preschool fix that?

Preschool and day care is not mandatory, which is something I’ve been demanding for a long time. If children with almost no or broken German go to school, they are often trapped for the rest of their education.


But if families have more money that doesn’t have to be bad either.

Single mothers are some of the socially worse-off people in Germany. Something should have been done for them, but this €150 won’t help them at all. They still have to go to work. But many other families will now wonder if they’d rather pay for day care for their children or make money. Free day care like in Berlin starting in 2011 is utopian elsewhere. We’ve tried to integrate families into society via the day care centres for years. Now we’ll send them away with a subsidy if they stay behind closed doors. It simply can’t really be true.


Heinz Buschkowsky (61) has been the mayor of Berlin’s Neukölln district since 2001. The Social Democrat has repeatedly tried to highlight the multicultural neighbourhood’s social problems. This interview by Sandra Dassler originally appeared in German in Der Tagesspiegel. Translation by The Local.

The Local (news@thelocal.de)

Produced in cooperation with
Der Tagesspiegel

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18:45 October 27, 2009 by Mapleleafdude
I would guess that no small amount of children will not be allowed to goto kindergarden because the parents would rather spend the money on fags and other stuff utterly useless for the kids. Hell if you have no chance of getting your hands on cash because your a lazy this a real good deal. Guess a lot of kindergardens will be closing in social hotspots all over the country. poor kids
19:19 October 27, 2009 by MrNosey
Yea, those pesky voters who can't be trusted with money and decision-making. [/extreme irritation and incredulity]
19:23 October 27, 2009 by Mapleleafdude
How many fags can you buy with 150? ? Dont be naive MrNosey. This well just leave more room for tampering with a childhood thats already getting a tough start. I wish we would only be talking about little houses and white fences in the alps but thats not the case in Berlin or Frankfurt.
19:51 October 27, 2009 by Edin
You Germans just can't get it can you?! Firstly you have to define what is exactly meant by integration, because for many of you this actually means assimilation, and you go around blabing about it like Borg from Star Treck.

If you want immigrants to really integrate, you have to make a better effort. You want Turks to get integrated but you ban teachers wearing headscarf in schools. You don't have any reckognition of immigrant traditions, holidays, etc. By your nacionalist merrits, you make it almost impossible for, I emphasise, HIGHLY educated immigrants, to get higher, managerial and political positions.....und so weiter. Can you please find me a single immigrant who hasn't fealt this on his own skin, at work, immigration office or just a public place.

Your assimilation plans will fail, and not because immigrans are uneducated and stupid, on contrary, they are clever enough to see your trying to completely deprive them of their origins, Germanize them.
20:14 October 27, 2009 by duckys
welp... looks like to look for job back in the states.... i can stand this crap... any longer... great!!! I thought i was getting somewhere... guess not...
20:38 October 27, 2009 by The-ex-pat
"If you want immigrants to really integrate, you have to make a better effort. You want Turks to get integrated but you ban teachers wearing headscarf in schools. You don't have any reckognition of immigrant traditions, holidays, etc. By your nacionalist merrits, you make it almost impossible for, I emphasise, HIGHLY educated immigrants, to get higher, managerial and political positions.....und so weiter."

Yet the majority of the people coming to Germany come from counties that would have absolutely no acceptance of Western attitudes, ie alcohol, women in public, relationships, our dress standards, however you expect Europe/Germans to accept everyone unconditionally.

"Can you please find me a single immigrant who hasn't fealt this on his own skin, at work, immigration office or just a public place."

Also what is your definition of an immigrant?? We are all immigrants here at The Local are we not. We all live and work in Germany, just like the people you point out. Should I start campaigning for a few English nation holidays to be introduced just because I live here and want to feel what, English in Germany????
00:48 October 28, 2009 by DavidtheNorseman
Children under 6 need to be with their mothers.
10:18 October 28, 2009 by Johnne
Thanks so much Edin, you said it all...I´m child of an immigrant so I know better. Thank you very very much sir.
10:28 October 28, 2009 by moistvelvet
"Children under 6 need to be with their mothers."

Or fathers ;-)

I was a home dad for the first 3 years and I intend to do the same with the second child despite the wife insisting on full time day area after 1 year.

However I do agree with the article about language, these children of immigrants need to be in some German language setting daily long before they start school.

Edin, you make a good point about the German attitude to qualifications gained outside Germany. In many cases, whether it be a bus license or Bachelor of Science degree, Germany does seem to be very selective in what they consider a credible qualification if it isn't German.
11:50 October 28, 2009 by eddymanly
Edin is right!
13:36 October 28, 2009 by LancashireLad
"Children under 6 need to be with their mothers"

Did you bother asking your children what they wanted? (Do you have any?)

That is actually not as stupid as it may sound.

Each have my two have been in day care since their first birthday. they've loved the entire experience. They make friends on the playground and can share things more easily than I've seen from most other children. When they had the emergency cover in the Creche/Kindergarten over Pfingsten (same organisation, son was in Kindergarten, daughter in Creche) they had all of the children in one kindergarten group. We had a fight every morning after that to get my daughter back in the Creche - she wanted to stay in the Kindergarten. She knew exactly what she wanted, and she started in the kindergarten at 2 1/2 because all the carers could see she was more than ready for it.

I myself was in school (no, not kindergarten, school with desks and teachers etc. ) at 3 1/2. Did me no harm whatsoever.

Zero tolerance, as the above statement suggests, has been proven many times to be counter productive, and in the case of childcare it definitely lies with the individual child *as well as* parental circumstances.

But being paid to keep your children at home??? Madness. To develop healthily as socially aware and responsible people, children need contact with peers much more than continual contact with Mummy/Daddy. I agree that this law is ridiculous - especially for the children if nobody else.
14:07 October 28, 2009 by Steven192
For a parent existing on Hartz4 and associated welfare handouts an extra 150Euros would be a lot of money and a huge temptation to take the kids out of daycare.

Not sure if I like the rather extreme blunt and frank way of expressing the ideas though, on the other hand it makes a change from all the PC touchy feely language.
14:29 October 28, 2009 by leeza
I really don't get the reasoning behind this subsidy. What are they trying to accomplish?
14:35 October 28, 2009 by Steven192
I'll give you one guess and if you say money saving then you win.

It costs a LOT more than 150euros a month to pay for daycare so every kid they can remove from the system saves money that can be spent on much more interesting things like bonuses for bank managers and the like.
14:38 October 28, 2009 by Krieg
I really don't get the reasoning behind this subsidy. What are they trying to accomplish?
When you are poor (i.e. Hartz 4) you only pay 20 EUR per month for childcare. It is obvious the state has to pay for the rest. You take your kid home and take care yourself and get money for it. At the end the state saves money.
14:39 October 28, 2009 by LeonG
They are probably saving money because I am assuming a subsidized daycare space will cost more than 150 a month. You could also say that by doing that, they are also giving parents a choice who want to stay home but can't afford to. In theory, everybody wins. In reality, there will be people who take their kids out of daycare to neglect them while they use the money for beer, their kids lose.
15:32 October 28, 2009 by UrbanAngel
Why the racist comment Mr Nosey, or did I miss something somewhere?
15:37 October 28, 2009 by bagatelle
Since the news always show us poor children getting their only proper meals in the Arche (from welfare) and schoolkids who are not even able to brush their teeth or dress themselves I always wondered what these Hartz IV mothers do all day? I mean if I don't have a job I should have plenty of time to take care for my kids, don't you think? Being "poor" does not mean there is nothing I can do to entertain or educate the kids. Heck, some Hartz IV families have more money than families in low wage jobs! So giving ?150 for keeping your kids at home will lead to even more neglected kids. These CSU guys are still dreaming of the Fifties when mom stayed at home and dad was the only breadwinner. I wonder if they will ever accept these days are gone.
15:42 October 28, 2009 by Krieg
The whole point of sending Hartz IV kids to childcare is because of SOCIALIZING, not because the mother does not have the time to take care of them. Plus in many states the childcare is in charged of doing some periodical tests to control the correct development of the kid and react on time if there are problems. Kids from Hartz IV families only get allotment for around 3 hours a day in childcare. And not always the Hartz IV mother is at home watching TV, sometimes they are (forced) taking some kind of training, in this case the kid can stay more hours in childcare.
16:36 October 28, 2009 by cinzia
I think if an adjustment should be made, it should be made in the direction of better-quality daycare or more daycare spots. 150 Euro isn't really enough to allow a parent who wants to stay home, to do so.

Almost all kids benefit from getting out of the house and socializing with other kids, whether or not they have an unemployed parent at home (or maybe especially if they have an unemployed parent at home.)
16:44 October 28, 2009 by MrNosey
Why the racist comment Mr Nosey, or did I miss something somewhere?
It wasn't racist it was ironic. *Note to self, switch irony tags on*

Check the previous posts to mine and you'll see that quite the opposite was meant by me.

The other posters were implying that 'those people' are incompetent parents who couldn't be trusted with their child's education and well-being and that they would smoke and drink this handout away. I found that point of view very condescending and racist.
17:17 October 28, 2009 by maxbrando
An amusing contrast: A picture of muslims atop an article about drinking!! ha ha ha!!
17:58 October 28, 2009 by Rimini
Mr. Nosey,

I don't think the majority of posters here have implied that Hartz IV parents would automatically waste that money on smoking and drinking. However, child neglect IS a problem in Hartz IV homes (not that it isn't elsewhere) and that makes the possibility of such a measure encouraging neglect at home a relevant thing to talk about, without making every person who does so a prejudiced classist.
19:43 October 28, 2009 by MrNosey
I would guess that no small amount of children will not be allowed to goto kindergarden because the parents would rather spend the money on fags and other stuff utterly useless for the kids. Hell if you have no chance of getting your hands on cash because your a lazy this a real good deal. Guess a lot of kindergardens will be closing in social hotspots all over the country. poor kids
For a parent existing on Hartz4 and associated welfare handouts an extra 150Euros would be a lot of money and a huge temptation to take the kids out of daycare.
In reality, there will be people who take their kids out of daycare to neglect them while they use the money for beer, their kids lose.
Rimini, you're sure about that?
19:56 October 28, 2009 by LeonG
MrNosey, are you saying that it would not happen that somebody would take their kids out of daycare to neglect them while they use the money for beer? Can you guarantee that?

Btw, I never uttered one word about what type of people might be likely to do that but I am sure there will be some.

I am not saying that anybody should be forced to put their kids in daycare, I am just saying I find it questionable to pay people not to.
20:03 October 28, 2009 by MrNosey
Leon

And there are rich parents who abuse their kids too. Why assume that it is typical of beer-drinking Hartz IV receivers?
20:10 October 28, 2009 by HerrDinksbumps
Cuz they're dumb rabble.
20:15 October 28, 2009 by LeonG
I never said it was typical of a Harz IV receiver to abuse their kids. You must be confusing me with somebody else.

And again, are you saying that it would not happen that somebody would take their kids out of daycare to neglect them while they use the money for beer? Can you guarantee that? Because that was all I said.

I happen to know that such people exist. I know a guy who was raised in a home like that. He suffered malnutrition because his parents didn't feed him properly when he was a child. His bone structure is somewhat messed up because of that. I have really no idea if they were Harz IV receivers or the equivalent there of or if they were rich and I know they weren't immigrants, they were alcoholics, that's all.
21:20 October 28, 2009 by Rimini
Rimini, you're sure about that?
The quote by Steven192 doesn't even say anything about beer or smokes, just significant financial incentive, and I maintain that the other two don't represent the majority here.
08:25 October 29, 2009 by Steven192
If Mr Nosey can not see that a large (30%?) increase in your monthly take home cash would tempt a lot of people then he is earning far too much money.
08:44 October 29, 2009 by tech71
And these low income kids in kindergarten recieve at least one decent meal a day. Correct?
09:48 October 29, 2009 by Mapleleafdude
If Mr Nosey can not see that a large (30%?) increase in your monthly take home cash would tempt a lot of people then he is earning far too much money.
thats the piont I thought had come across in my post. thanks for stating it a little more obvious Steven192.

-I think this discussion is based on a big misinterpretation by the gentleman in the interview anyways. the 150? that a Hartz4 recipient would get for taking his/her child out of Kindergarden would instantly be deducted from the Hartz4 payout because the 150? (my guess) would count as income (correct me if I'm wrong here).
10:07 October 29, 2009 by Krieg
the 150? that a Hartz4 recipient would get for taking his/her child out of Kindergarden would instantly be deducted from the Hartz4 payout because the 150? (my guess) would count as income (correct me if I'm wrong here).
That does not make sense at all.
10:10 October 29, 2009 by westvan
the 150? that a Hartz4 recipient would get for taking his/her child out of Kindergarden would instantly be deducted from the Hartz4 payout because the 150? (my guess) would count as income (correct me if I'm wrong here).
It is indeed just your guess. We don't know for sure, and I don't think there's be as much fuss about it if that were true.
10:45 October 29, 2009 by Rimini
-I think this discussion is based on a big misinterpretation by the gentleman in the interview anyways. the 150? that a Hartz4 recipient would get for taking his/her child out of Kindergarden would instantly be deducted from the Hartz4 payout because the 150? (my guess) would count as income (correct me if I'm wrong here).
What would the point of that be, though? They already hav that choice right now: Have the kid in kindergarten or at home with no change in their current Hartz IV income. So why introduce a measure that would merely shift the particular government source of their money, not the amount? While increasing bureaucratic costs?
11:20 October 29, 2009 by westvan
I have a feeling the EUR 150 would be *in addition* to other benefits and that's why they think certain people might use it unwisely.
11:31 October 29, 2009 by Steven192
While on the face of it the idea of giving it with one hand taking with the other does sound stupid, I would not be in the least bit surprised if that is exactly what happens.
11:44 October 29, 2009 by Mapleleafdude
Hartz4 regulations are very strict in terms of added income and only have very few exceptions as to what can be earned on top. the recipient of the 150 would have to prove that the added resources are only used for the "teaching/childcare" at home since hartz4 supposedly covers all costs of raising a child in the first place.
10:33 October 30, 2009 by derExDeutsche
WOW!!! Has someone here figured it out?!?

So, a party WANTS to KEEP and GROW its voter base by rewarding complete dependence on the State? Say it ain't so! Then it ROBS more money from productive citizens to stick the 'Criminals' this policy creates in Govt. run Corrections Systems?

OMG! And all this on a website about Germany? who would have ever thought?!? Is Germany waking from its slumber, too? The NWO is coming, where do you stand?
16:27 October 30, 2009 by 247redeemed
Grandma's are FAR superior to STRANGERS. This society is crippled for the simple fact that moms are not moms and dads are not dads. The communists wanted the STATE to be the "moms & dads" and so it still is today. This has bred selfish parents who have abdicated their duties to their children. Hurrah for Angela Merkel who is only trying to turn a societies heart back to the hearts of the children!! What a novel idea! Stay home and love the children I CHOSE to bring into this world.
15:47 November 2, 2009 by William Thirteen
hmm...150 per month is 1800 per year...if i can buy a child for 2000 i can start getting a positive return on investment after only 14 months! perhaps purchase a dozen or so, bundle the returns together as 'state backed security' and sell shares to interested investors. of course i'll need an independent risk evaluator to certify the shares - one knows how hard it is to move any 'sub-prime' assets these days...
23:04 November 3, 2009 by dleephotography
Edin and Moistvelvet, maybe you should examine the definition of Integration and assimilation. Turkish teachers wearing headscarves in German schools IS NOT assimilating. How many native born german teachers do you see in headscarves???!!! and why is it asking too much for the auslanders to speak enough german to get by on a daily basis?? this is just another example of multiculturalism gone haywire when will you ever learn???
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