May 22, 2012
Published: 17 Feb 12 08:02 CET
Online: http://www.thelocal.de/national/20120217-40799.html
The United States vowed Thursday to retain close military ties to its European allies after unveiling plans to withdraw more than 11,000 troops from Germany and Italy as part of a strategic shift to Asia.
What do you think? Leave your comment below.
Bayern Munich midfielder Bastian Schweinsteiger has apologised to German President Joachim Gauck for failing to shake his hand after his penalty miss meant that Bayern lost Saturday's Champions League final to Chelsea. READ »
Hertha Berlin are to appeal the German Football Association's (DFB) decision to uphold the result of the controversial match that left them relegated to the second division. READ »
A powerful solar telescope billed as the largest in Europe opened Monday on Spain's Canary Islands which scientists say will allow them to study the sun in unprecedented detail. Its main backer was a German institute. READ »
It took three years of careful planning, but German librarians have – very neatly – signed a pact to race to each other’s aid in the event of a book-related disaster. READ »
Former central banker Thilo Sarrazin has provoked outrage by arguing that Germany's euro policy is driven by a Holocaust guilt trip. He also said the single currency was always a bad idea. Does he have a point? Have your say. READ (19 COMMENTS) »
Weighing 110 kilograms, Bruno “the Orca” Dobelmann may not look like an athlete, but on Monday he set off to swim across Lake Constance in just a pair of trunks. If he succeeds, the German will set a new world record. READ »
Ex-central banker turned controversy merchant Thilo Sarrazin has attracted fresh outrage with a book claiming Germany's European policy is driven by guilt for World War II and the Holocaust. READ (8 COMMENTS) »
A German man died on Mount Everest where he was helping clear the world's highest peak of rubbish, Nepalese tourism officials announced. His death brings the season's toll to five. READ (4 COMMENTS) »
See all ads | Join the Marketplace
1113 jobs available
797 new jobs this week
111 new jobs today
More news from Sweden at thelocal.se
More news from Switzerland at thelocal.ch
More news from France at thelocal.fr
More news from Norway at thelocal.no
Dating
Looking for your own blonde bombshell? Or is the strong, silent type more your
style? Find a German sweetheart here.
Weather
"After clouds comes clear weather," say the Germans. But what about after that? Find out in The Local's weather
section.
Blog
German stuff that's distracting us today.
Noticeboard
Whether you want to buy, sell, hire, announce or promote something, here's the place to do it - completely free of
charge.
Discuss
Debate the news, ask for advice, make friends - or just let off steam.
Register now for:
> Free use of noticeboard
> Special discounts
> Weekly news roundup
> Unlimited use of discuss
Your comments about this article:
We should open up one of our closed bases and allow NATO to train for the next 50+yrs as we have been in Europe since 1945. They can help boost OUR communities for a change. After all, America provides a better and more realistic training environment resembling where most of the world's conflicts are currently, the Middle East. Prince Harry just completed some training in the Mojave desert, (not far from my home town), prior to deploying to Afghanistan.
While I do agree with a lot of your points. The one big issue that has always been there and will continue to be. Is, Logistics. When one looks at all the wars since the industrial revolution. Where have most of them started and by whom. It's been in Europe and Asia. Even Vietnam was a fight between Ho Chi Minh and the French colonialists and the Japanese occupiers long before America was involved. The Middle east and Africa was colonized by Europeans. Who redrew border lines on the maps when the Europeans withdrew their Middle eastern/African colonies? Thereby helping set up future conflicts. The League of Nations. Which mostly consisted of European politicians. Even after WWI the Americans argued against punishing Germany so harshly. But the Europeans wanted to stick it to them. Thereby setting up a future war in Europe. So, Given the distances involved and the fact that Europe/Asia seems to be where the wars take place. It only makes since to have your troops and supplies nearby.
The Luftwaffles have already landed!
http://www.holloman.af.mil/library/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=4364
The local economy is making some money off of foreign military. Maybe not much, but some...
We need these soldiers taking regular jobs that rebuild America, not some angry bunch that despises them.
Maybe it is just to expensive to care anymore.
If forward basing is needed, and if doesn't violate treaties with the former Warsaw Pack, then facilities in places like Hungary, Poland, or even Romania can be worked.
Basing Soldiers in Europe on the other hand has ensured global stability and taught both Americans and Europeans how to better cooperate - not a tangible bang for the buck, but something that we wouldn't have today had we isolated ourselves like we did after WWI. What would have happened after WWII, had we isolated ourselves in the Mojave Desert (stuck our heads in the sand per say - like we did after WWI)? World War III - very likely. Imagine the cost of a WWIII to America and the world - in lives and $. Or perhaps hiding behind our borders would have protected us....
The U.S. fiscal situation is our own fault! American culture has thrived on spending above our means and making the quick buck for the benefit of the individual and at cost of the whole. Selfish! And then, instead of focusing on how to fix it, we played the blame-game and hoped it would get better soon. If America wants to maintain its position as a world power - economic, military, influence - then we better wake up!
I'd like to believe that those Europeans who've expressed negative opinions in this forum about American military presence in Europe are the minority. If anyone here thinks we can euthanize the trans-Atlantic relationship - you're nuts. Europe and America benefit tremendously from our economic and cultural ties; and the American military presence in Europe the past 60+ years has been "der Zement."
Sir/Ma'am ... you are an idiot.
Takes one to know one!
"you're an uneducated fool"
My my, such harsh language! However, this "uneducated fool" obviously hit a nerve that drew your response.. I myself don't respond to "uneducated fools" But I will make this exception!. I have heard similar comments but in the current world we live in, with advanced communications, countries are able to communicate better, Your view isn't reality in today's world climate. With current technologies, cyber warfare, satellites, drones, ships, aircraft, missiles, there is no need for "boots on the ground".
It would be a better idea to build floating bases in strategic locations around the world in neutral waters and keep them supplied. Or send ships as in the Abraham Lincoln is currently located, which is allowing free trade and stability in the Straight of Hormuz..
I do agree we as Americans are to blame for our own financial mess. But ask one of the millions unemployed Americans what they think about our tax $ being handed out to appease foreign countries to prevent wars. Sounds to me like BLACK MAIL! North Korea makes bombs hoping to bargain for food from the US, Pakistan is payed millions for their support, (and they can't be trusted, but trust me they are laughing their way to the bank). Millions wasted in Iraq and Afghanistan, and the worst is the deaths of thousands of US and allied soldiers. As a retired soldier myself, I am still struggling with what we have gained, (and that is a big "WHAT"), and does it justify all the lives lost.
As for WWI and WWII, we didn't have bases throughout Europe and still the allies prevailed.
I am from Germany but live in the UK now and every time I speak to someone from the British Army over here who has been living in Germany, they always say they loved it and would want to go back. That always makes me feel very proud about my home country and what we have achieved. I was a teenager in the 80s and when I went abroad in those days I always felt embarrassed being German because of our history. In that respect I think we have come such a long way.
I would be quite interested to know how the American Soldiers feel about leaving. Any comments welcome...
The basing of Allied troops in Germany wasnt to prevent the uprising of ex-Nazi's and having a 4th Reich, or an uprising. It was to keep the Soviets in check, so they didnt run ramshod across Western Europe. It is a documented fact that Russia wanted to go as far west as the Allies would allow. Once the war was over, the other major Allied victors kept troops in place to balance out the potential threat of Communism. Thus began the "Cold War". Speaking specifically of American troops, they were to act as a speed bump against any Soviet invasion, until more American, or even NATO troops could be mustered to stop an invasion.
As for American troops in Germany, I have not yet met a single one who said they hated Germany, and almost all have said they want to go back.
Thus, for the Germans really wanting the Americans out, at least they made the Ami's feel good while they were there!
"Thus, for the Germans really wanting the Americans out, at least they made the Ami's feel good while they were there!".
That's because we spent lots of American tax dollars and provided lots of jobs for the Germans. Most if not all Americans are overcharged on rent from German landlords. Just ask any German if they would pay the same and the answer would be "NO". Not to mention the how many millions are paid for the numerous bases and the upkeep, the costs of training FTXs, the costs of damages caused by training exercises, the chickens that were run over by our tanks and the multiple generations of chickens the dead chicken would have had.
Don't get me wrong, I don't dislike Germany but until we invent a money tree, we can't keep spending like some people use their credit cards. How much more of a deficit do we need? Is there no end? I hope we don't end up like Greece and have to impose the same austerity measures in America. If that happens, I'm sure the masses would make the occupy demonstrations look like boy scout camp outs.
Oh, I am quite sure. I lived in Germany in the early 90s, and I remember some base closures from BRAC 93. The local economy was going to be devastated, so many people were going to be out of a job, the sky was falling... BAS/BAH rates were through the roof. You made almost as much in COLA, as you did your base pay.
But, the money train is running out of steam. Like you, I fear that we will be like Greece in a few years. Living in California, I have had a front row seat to the collapse of the housing market. After our recent trip to Germany, we are downsizing, in the hopes to be able to move. If not to Germany, than somewhere.
You should not feel embarrassed with your history. It is a truth to say that the guilty always explain something, just because they feel guilty. There shall be some troops left anyway. Hmm, well when I talk with my high school friends from our military high school base, many of them are F-16 fellows actually in the discussion we talk about your German troops and about Germany as a nice country, with very high taxes. I think that continuation of the discussion as Germans should be at constant embarrassed of its history honestly is boring.
Look, you can't educate or inform people like him/her who get all their news from FOX and Rush Limbaugh. These people will take any "talking point" and repeat it, truth or not. He believes Pres Obama is Muslim, for example.
Just look at him, as instructed by the Fox News/Murdoch masters, going after Social Security and Medicare. Yes, these programs need adjustment but these same people, including Presidential candidates, bemoaned the fact the U.S. was puling out(finally) of Iraq. As for the trillions wasted with forward basing and maintaining huge forces and infrastructure overseas, yes, it was good for defense contractors and the military forces who were fortunate to experience living abroad. But for the U.S. to shoulder the majority of Europe's defense(and Japan's too) decades after WWII just speaks to the idiocy of empire.
And I love my country with all my heart. The Marshall Plan did the trick and Europe will just have to live with Germany's economic strength, built on decades of low defense expenditures and U.S. protection. Just think about it. The U.S. had to force the intiative in the former Yugoslavia, barely a decade ago. Even in Libya, it was the U.S. that provided the backbone for NATO to perform the air campaign. The billions wasted, squandered, in Iraq speaks for itself.
Finally, a clearer, more focused long range defense doctrine is being formed that finally makes sense. Never again to nation building. Be prepared for one and a half major conflicts. If Europe hasn't resolved to handle it's centuries of internal conflicts peacefully by now, it never will.