November 20, 2009
Published: 18 Oct 09 12:00 CET
Online: http://www.thelocal.de/national/20091018-22649.html
Just a week after it emerged that the German armed forces was getting a different kind of A/H1N1 vaccine to the general population, Der Spiegel magazine reports that the government will also get special treatment.
The Local (news@thelocal.de)
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Your comments about this article:
Squalene, in short "gulf war syndreome", and our old friend thimerosol, 49.4 % mercury.
anyone think that they'll let their family be injected with this stuff?
Go grow some brains, please.
and by the way, we don't "grow" brains. We have to use what we were given. As they used to say at school, "could try harder".
edit
Wolf Dieter Ludwig, head of the medicines commission of the association of German doctors, called the decision by the government to take a different vaccine from the untested and toxic swine flu jab destined for the rest of the population a "scandal" of a dimension that can hardly be communicated to the general public. "The health authorities have fallen for a campaign from the pharmaceutical companies, who just want to earn money with an illusory threat," Ludwig said. Vaccines with adjuvants have not been tested on pregnant women and children even though the German govenrment has said these are priority groups. Among the government officials to get the "swine flu" jab without mercury and adjuvants will be the employees of the Paul Ehrlich Institute, the government drug regulator which ordered "swine flu" jabs with mercury and squalene to the rest of the population.
Especially when it comes from powerful people who have already said that the stuff to be given to the plebs is potentially too harmful for themselves and their army/armies?
If you are prepared to let your children, if you have any, get injected with untested vaccines just because a politician says that it's ok, then I honestly feel sorry for you and your kids.
_______________________________________
The vaccine has been "developed" by Baxter Vaccines, they have a nice corporate looking website, that tells you all they want you to know, here,
http://www.baxtervaccines.com/
The thing about Baxter is that it's dirty.
Baxter uses BSL 3 (Biosafety Level 3) precautions in its laboratories, a system for the safe-handling of toxic substances, which makes an accidental contamination of ordinary flu material with the dangerous bird flu virus virtually impossible.
What they would prefer you not to know is that Baxter manufactured an influenza material which was contaminated with a bird flu virus in its biomedical research laboratories in Orth on the Danube in December 2008. Virtually impossible with BSL 3.
The contaminated vaccine material contained a mixture of a seasonable H3N2 human influenza virus and the deadly H5N1 virus. By adding a virus of the type H5N1 to an ordinary flu virus of the type H3N2, Baxter produced a highly dangerous biological weapon with a 63 per cent mortality rate.
The H5N1 virus is restricted in its human-to-human transmissibility, especially because it is less airborne.
However, when it is combined with seasonal flu viruses, which are airborne and easily spread, a new flu virus is created which is unknown to the human immune system and which will have a severe impact on an unprotected population.
A deadly virus of this kind could spread around the world in a short time and infect millions and even billions of people.
Baxter distributed via Avir a number of these contaminated vaccines using false concealment and a false label to 16 laboratories in Austria and in other countries at the end of January/beginning of February, potentially infecting at least 36-37 laboratory staff, who had had to be treated preventively for bird flu and ordinary flu in hospital.
If you're still with me, you might as well read this,
http://birdflu666.wordpress.com/2009/04/13/case-about-bird-flu/
Donald Rumsfeld would be proud. He might even smile, 'cause he holds the patent.
That's another story though, if you do some research into,
tamiflu, gilead sciences, george schultz, yes he was on board too, and donny rumsfeld,
I really hope you find out more than me.
With any luck, you'll skip the vaccines for deadly diseases as well, and really be out of the way. The Darwin Effect, I think it's called.
Btw, you can have my vaccine, too :)
With any luck, you'll skip the vaccines for deadly diseases as well, and really be out of the way. The Darwin Effect, I think it's called.
If you examine the facts... (and baxter is only a small piece of a very large puzzle) anyone with the ability to critically analyse the facts will come up asking more and more valid questions.
The normal Flu kills approx 30,000 yearly in the US alone... the swine flu has so far managed approx 3000 worldwide (and the larger proportion of these deaths are from complications and not directly from swine flu itself)... the swine flu was given pandemic level 6 status very early. Pandemic level 6 from my understanding allows for the suspension of many rights enshrined in law in many countries.
Why have vaccine manufacturers been given immunity from prosecution/litigation for this particular "vaccine" if it is "safe as houses"?
The facts just do not add up. I for one will be avoiding this so called vaccine with vigour.
you blindly slag me off, and yet have the whole internet to debunk what I've said.
fact is you can't be bovvered.
you'd prefer to let your kids be injected with mercury and squalene, before asking google a couple of simple questions, and reading the answers. Total time involved 10 mins.
never mind, go back to your soaps, wastrels.
I only hate the merger with the Local when idiot idiots like these people join up and spout their nonsense, then fade back into cyberspace trolldom.
and that's all you do.
You're all the same. All who criticise those of us who actually look a little deeper than fox news, or the bbc come to that. No questioning comment, only poor attempts at pissing the furthest ...
trolls, rofl.
Which one of us do you think is more likely to be a troll?
Btw, you can have my vaccine, too
But since you're so interested in the topic, I'll ask you the same question I've posed to others on this forum. WHY would the government intentionally poison, or allow to be poisoned, the same population from which they draw the only power they have?
I find it interesting that the US has done its best to corner the global market of the "safer" variant of the flu shot. That's another reason why Germany and other countries can only get limited supplies of it.
The U.S. government wanted more single-dose syringes because they contain only very small amounts of thimerosal, a mercury-containing substance that causes concern among some people, he said. Multidose vials contain more thimerosal.
I'm in one of the lowest risk groups. Will I get the swine flu shot? Don't know yet. It's a tough call.
In itself, not a bad question.
I don't think however that the govt. actually have any intent in this direction. I think that they've been hoodwinked the same as you.
There was a good program on ARD in the week, had a couple of govt people, and a couple of doctors. The doctors were taking the very same line as me, the govt singing the praises to the "vaccine". Go figure ... Wolf-Dieter Ludwig was there.
"The federal government has spent $2 billion to buy about 250 million doses of vaccine and has pledged to buy enough to immunize every American if there is enough demand."
hey look ... 2 billion beer tokens. .... if there is enough demand.
there you have it, plain and simple. $$$$$$$$$ as usual.
When the trial for this was going on, ie the first pig flu, I told folk that tamiflu was only a coining mechanism for the top dogs at gilead sciences. If you've read my posts you'll know who and what gilead are.
One afternoon on bbc 5 live, Liam Donaldson was asked how much exactly is Tamiflu costing the British govt. His answer was, "It's a confidential business secret". I paraphrase, 'cause I can't remember his exact words, but they were something like that.
Now, he wasn't asked anything about profit levels, or anything that might be regarded as secret or confidential, he was asked how much are the taxpayers of the UK paying Rumsfeld Schultz and co, for Tamiflu. How much was the official licence price. Something the taxpayers had a right to know.
Unfortunately the bbc "journalist" then let him off the hook, as they normally do, and took his way out, asking nothing further.
The official price, as far as I've been able to find out is something in the region of 100 dollars a hit ....
'course you can get it quicker and cheaper on ebay, but we're on about official prices. All this time I was saying that tamiflu was no cure anyway, was a pile of crap.
Hey!! Guess what, a little over two weeks after the Donaldson interview, the very same "journalist" came to the same conclusion. Saying that, it did little to help, and indeed may actually do more harm.
It was only a one off, not heard again. But the point is that they said it.
Now, what is the difference between tamiflu and the "vaccine".
I'm asking you now, 'cause for the life of me, I can't see any difference.
The vaccine cannot have been tested sufficiently. That in itself should be enough. But, it isn't. That the govt are going to be given a vaccine without squaline or thimerosal, should demand at least some questions. That they are being given this untested stuff says to me that they haven't asked enough questions.
doesn't cost much to ask ...
You do realize that the H1N1 vaccine is being made the exact same way, in the exact same labs and by the exact same companies that make the seasonal flu vaccine every year?
So do you contend that the seasonal flu vaccine is also not tested sufficiently every year?
As for Tamiflu prices, I couldn't tell you what they are. My case is mild and I don't need it. Nor do most people who get the flu.
hey look ... 2 billion beer tokens. .... if there is enough demand.
there you have it, plain and simple. $$$$$$$$$ as usual.
Don't discuss it because you might make people scared???
It may cost a lot more not to ask.
I think it's highly ironic that some people on this thread are calling ME brainwashed, when they have not a jot of evidence that the 2009 H1N1 flu vaccine is in any way harmful to the people it is designed for, other than the listed possible side effects.
On the other hand, testing has been done to show that it is safe. Evidence for safety: yes. Evidence against safety: no, other than the listed side effects.
Does the seasonal flu vaccine severely sicken or kill significant numbers of people every year? No. The H1N1 vaccine is exactly the same, except that it has only one strain of flu represented, rather than the three or four strains that make up the seasonal flu vaccine.
maybe you could also point out some independent squalene and thimerosal tests at the same time, they would surely be worth a peruse?
And we're talking of a/h1n1 btw ...
If you are asking for "independent" research separate from that conducted by NIAID and pharmaceutical companies according to FDA guidelines, you are expecting more research than what exists for any drug sold and marketed in the USA.
Think about it: other than the pharmaceutical companies who stand to profit from an approved medication (or lose a lot of money on clinical trials of a medication that is not eventually approved, which happens more often), and the government, which has an interest in the public health, who would pay for such research? You might be disappointed if you're hoping for more "independence" than that, but that's the situation for all drugs sold in the US, and I suspect that situation is no different anywhere else in the world.
In 2004 the IOM reconvened to consider newly published evidence bearing on the proposed association between thimerosal-containing vaccines and autism(13). This included epidemiologic studies from several countries (Denmark(14), Great Britain(15,16), Sweden(17) and the US(18)) using cohort and/or ecologic designs, as well as studies using passive surveillance data from the US Vaccine Adverse Events Reporting System. For those interested in further details, the report provides tabular summaries of all studies reviewed and a discussion in the text of key findings as well as the methodologic strengths and weaknesses of the different study designs. With these added data the Committee was able to conclude that "the evidence favors rejection of a causal relationship between thimerosal containing vaccines and autism." The IOM added that since "all well designed epidemiological studies provide evidence of no association between thimerosal and autism, the Committee recommends that risk-benefit assessments regarding the use of thimerosal-containing versus thimerosal-free vaccines and other biological or pharmaceutical products, whether in the United States or other countries, should not include autism as a potential risk."
Since the 2004 IOM report additional publications have underscored the lack of association between thimerosal and neurodevelopmental disorders(15,16,19,20).
Detailed studies involving multiple developmental analyses of school-aged children exposed to ethylmercury as part of US immunization programs before 1999 are under way, and publication of results is expected in 2007. A commentary on the theoretical association between thimerosal and autism was published in 2003 by two pediatric neurologists(21). This report clearly points out that the profile of neuroanatomic pathology and of clinical signs and symptoms associated with autism is different in many key aspects from that associated with mercury toxicity.
By the way, all this information has been found by easy internet searches, which you could do yourself. I'm not out to prove anything about the safety, or not, of the H1N1 vaccine, or any other vaccine. It just irks me when people blithely toss out unsubstantiated rumors in a situation where thousands of people worldwide are dead, and tens of thousands of people are very ill or hospitalized. I just can't let that kind of malignant intent stand without challenge.
here's a more succinct question,
Where are the randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled studies proving flu vaccines are both safe and effective?
doesn't matter where the qualified answer comes from ...
EDIT: And PLEASE do attempt to come up with a more reliable source than "http://birdflu666.wordpress.com/"
Bird flu 666? Seriously?
Well, I took your advice, BS, and read up on it. Not on the crappy doomsday websites you frequent, but the chemical facts. Apparently, its a naturally occuring chemical in the human body. Its an important part of the process of cholesterol, vitamin D, and steroid hormones.
That's real sneaky of those damn pharma companies... putting substances into our bodies that are GASP... already there!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swine_influenza
Further more, the people who got vaccinated in 1970 US outbreak AT THE TIME thought all was good. I personally have a friend who has Guillain-Barré Syndrome as a result of the vaccination, trust me, its horrible. He was vaccinated in the US Army as they were required to be.
Their are stories upon stories of vaccinations that have ruined lives especially when rushed, the CDC and government are under heavy pressure to respond to this, its easier to deal with the mess of bad vaccinations in order to give people a sense of comfort while the event is happening. Good hygiene and personal awareness goes a long way, this swine flu will pass, the difference between those that got vaccinated and those that didn't is that the ones that did, will always have that vaccine a part of their person.
I personally need to see a well balenced argument, instead of internet hotheads telling me not to take it.
it's getting late, but katekatekoala, you did at least do some research, and I honestly thank you for that. You didn't do enough though ..
I'll tell you why tomorrow, but wikipedia will let very little light in with this as to most things, and http://birdflu666.wordpress.com seems to have finished in august, or sometime, at any rate that was the first time I've seen it ...
here's a clue. We need water, so we drink it. What happens if we breath it?
Seasonal flu vaccine is made available in September of every year. The H1N1 vaccine in America was promised in October, but most of it won't be available till November or December.
You do the math. How can the H1N1 vaccine be said to have been rushed?
Again, if you have a problem with the annual seasonal flu vaccine and its testing and distribution, you will have a problem with H1N1. Do a significant number of people have serious side effects or die from the annual seasonal flu vaccine every year? No. Why would you then expect problems with H1N1?
ps. Do you work for the CDC?
married?
... yes, married, geez ... (slams door)
Here are the randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled safety and efficacy studies...just three of the 100 or so current and ongoing studies in the US alone.
Sinovac Biotech Co., Ltd
A Double-blind, Randomized, Stratified and Controlled Clinical Trial With Split-virion and Whole-virion, Adjuvanted and Non-adjuvanted Influenza A/H1N1 Vaccines in Healthy Adults, Elders, Adolescents and Children
National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID)
Prevention, Randomized, Double Blind (Subject, Investigator, Outcomes Assessor), Parallel Assignment, Safety/Efficacy Study
A Phase II Study in Healthy Adult and Elderly Populations to Assess the Safety and Immunogenicity of an Unadjuvanted Sanofi Pasteur H1N1 Influenza Vaccine Administered at Two Dose Levels
Sanofi-Aventis
Immunogenicity and Safety of Multiple Formulations of an Intramuscular Inactivated, Split Virion Swine-origin A/H1N1 Influenza Vaccine With and Without Adjuvant in Healthy European Subjects Aged 6 to 35 Months
and so on...
Source
Next phase is pregnant women - they get the antidote as well because they are needed to repopulate the place.
When it then comes to the rest of the populace, who having seen all the fatalities from the flu will all be desperate to get the "cure".. well what you get all depends on who and what you are, which demographic do you fit?
This and other conspiraloon theories brought to you by "The shape shifting lizards are taking over my brain Gmbh" in association with "The Tinfoil Hat Makers Cooperative".
Why is it that you think your "views" should hold the same weight as facts, anyway?
... yes, married, geez ... (slams door)
Interesting too, that after 1976, and the litigations that followed that fiaso, Ms Sibelius the US Secretary of Health and Human Services, issued a decree that grants vaccine makers total legal immunity from any lawsuits that result from any new ?Swine Flu? vaccine.
nice.
Interesting too is that Baxter, in who's labs the virtually impossible meeting of h1n1 and a seasonal flu took place in Dec 2008, have filed to patent an h1n1 vaccine. Lol. And the rest, H2N2, H3N2, H5N1, H7N7, H1N2, H9N2, H7N2, H7N3, H10N7 subtypes, of the pig flu H1N1, H1N2, H3N1 and H3N2 subtypes, of the dog or horse flu H7N7, H3N8 subtypes or of the avian H5N1, H7N2, H1N7, H7N3, H13N6, H5N9, H11N6, H3N8, H9N2, H5N2, H4N8, H10N7, H2N2, H8N4, H14N5, H6N5, H12N5 subtypes. !!
nice.
Obama has given 7 billion us beer tokens to fast track vaccinations for influenza.
nice for baxter and glaxosmithkline.
you can hear 'em now, if you listen a bit ...
we're in the money, we're in the money, we're in the money, we're in the money, we're in the money, ....
squalene is indeed part of our makeup. It's an oil.
I love olive oil. In salads and in the frying pan.
I wouldn't like to say what would happen if I put some in me arm ....
But I suppose the situation is a little different in the US where the virus seems a lot more widely-spread.
As for the government getting a different vaccine. Is this by any chance due to one being sold in ampules containing more than one dose as opposed to just one dose (that would be the one the government gets)? I remember reading something like that somewhere.
Why is it that you think your "views" should hold the same weight as facts, anyway?
I dont watch any news on television or anywhere really, I don't care for tv too much and I find my time spent with the family, etc a better return.
The marriage line was a classic volley of words in Sixteen Candles by Long Duk Dong, sorry you didn't pick up on it or its meaning for my posting it.
Well, internet is getting shut off for my move this week, was a blast conversing, more seriously though ... found some good info and will come back again while living in Germany to search stuff, etc ... best wishes all.
In addition, a lot of Americans will be getting the vaccine (if it becomes available before they get sick) because many Americans don't get paid sick time off work. I personally find it very scary that restaurant workers, for example, almost never get paid to just stay home from work. Instead, they'll go in and sneeze on your table, your food, etc.
If I'm not mistaken from your other posts, you have two kids under the age of 18, and a pregnant wife who works in a hospital. All of them, but especially your wife, should get the H1N1 vaccine, and I consider it a public service to get under your skin about it, if I can.
If I'm not mistaken from your other posts, you have two kids under the age of 18, and a pregnant wife who works in a hospital. All of them, but especially your wife, should get the H1N1 vaccine, and I consider it a public service to get under your skin about it, if I can.
Anyhow facts are, these companies do have the experience for vaccine manufacturing and do meet international regulatory guidelines, specifically GMP. The vaccine itself still undergoing efficacy trials but it is already a huge money boom.
I think people should look at the data critically and interest playing on this issue. When dealing with pharmaceuticals especially biopharmaceuticals, this kind of issues are not black or white, the truth is in between, people should make an informed decision based on facts plus independent advise/research etc.
I have decided that the "facts" are not good enough for me or my family. There are different formulations for the swine vaccine, the one containing squalene should be carefully scrutinized, I personally would never take a pharmaceutical product containing squalene in the formulation...
Also makes you wonder why so many health-related professionals are refusing taking this vaccine...
7
Nothing in education is so astonishing as the amount of ignorance it accumulates in the form of inert facts.
But not, for example, whether approval of the H1N1 vaccine was "rushed", as delvek contends. Unless you insist that the seasonal flu vaccine is rushed to market every single year.
You will not find me contending that squalene or thimerosal are safe, for example. I don't know anything about squalene, because it's not included in US vaccines. Thimerosal is supposedly safe in the small amounts in the vaccine, but I'm saying you can request vaccine without it, if you have concerns.
http://www.who.int/vaccine_safety/topics/adjuvants/squalene/Jun_2006/en/index.html
I'm searching for a balanced argument - but based on all facts and opinion I've heard to date, the presence of squaline would not stop me taking the injection.
That said, in previous years after being offered the seasonal flu vaccine (free by employer) I always chose to decline, and I don't see this year being any different. I'm invincible....